Hip Cat Fascist: The Best Band Name You'll Never Hear With Mike Dressel

This week I sat down with my oldest, most annoyingly-always-right friend, Mike Dressel — writer, plant dad, t-shirt auteur, and the reason I've seen approximately 400 things I wouldn't have otherwise seen. (He's almost always right. It's exhausting.) The man also accidentally coined what is objectively the greatest band name of all time, which you'll have to listen to find out — but I promise it involves a cat, a bad hip, and the creeping wave of fascism. 

So, ya know. Relatable.

We go everywhere: the disillusionment-to-essayist pipeline, why Gen X had the best music and also kind of raised itself on caffeine and neglect, what gay culture is finally leaving behind (and what it stubbornly won't), and why Mike is now, definitionally, a rave widow. We talk mental health, SSRIs, the specific shame of listening to Ryan Adams alone in your house, David Lynch on acid, and the mystifying persistence of algorithm pop stars who Mike is convinced are not real people.

We also do Bibliomancy, which tells Mike his style evolution will be nothing short of messianic. Skinny jeans, apparently, are back.

Candles optional. Bwain pills recommended.

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Transcript

Julia 0:05

Are you haunted by the thoughts that show up at 3 a.m.? Good. This is where we follow them. Where science meets ritual, humor meets reckoning, and aging and identity are viewed as evolution. And is where we ask the only question that matters. How do we craft a life that can hold what emerges? Candles optional. Curiosity required. Ghosts welcome. I'm your host Julia Granacki and this is AGECRAFT After Dark.

Intro

Julia 0:32 Julia 1:22

Hello ladies and gentlemen, theys and thems, welcome to the show. I often think about the winding, occassionally baffling path that got me here. I went to school for theatre. I was absolutely convinced I was going to be an actor and life as it tends to do had other plans and I ended up somewhere completey different and honestly? I regret nothing. But even though my career took a detour, the arts have always remained a huge part of my life. Theater, music, dance, books, weird little art projects, and probably, you know, things that kind of only make sense to the person making them. You name it. I feel like I have created or done it. And when I think about the people who have most shaped my taste and expanded my world in those areas, today's guest is at the very top of the list. Michael Dressel has probably dragged me, sometimes willingly, sometimes not, to more plays, concerts, films, books, and cultural experiences than anyone else I know. And here's the annoying thing. He's almost always right. If Mike tells me to read a book, I read it. If he tells me to listen to an album, I listen to it. If he tells me to see a show, I buy the ticket. And at this point, resisting would be just really stupid because, like I said, he is always right. Mike is a writer, plant dad, pet step parent, former actor, educator, creator of art, designer of delightfully kooky t-shirts, and veteran of jobs ranging from the random to the genuinely absurd. He lives in Astoria, Queens, and more importantly, he is one of my dearest friends. I am so excited to have him on the show today. Let's get into it.

Interview

Julia 2:45

Hi, how are you?

Mike 2:46

Hello. I'm good.

Julia 2:49

So glad you're here.

Mike 2:50

I'm happy to be here.

Julia 2:54

Excellent. All right, we're gonna start with you stating your name, your pronouns, your age, and answering the question of what is keeping you up at night?

Mike 3:06

Great. My name is Mike Dressel. My pronouns are he, him, but I will accept any, to be honest. My age is 48 at the time of this recording. And what is keeping me up at night? Oh, the things. I think I told you I have pets, and the cat is particularly like bad at personal space boundaries because they're cats, and he's not standoffish. Like most cats, he's very like in your face. And then, of course, they always get the like 3 a.m. Like wake up. So yeah, that's that's definitely keeping me up. And then you know, my hips bothering me. You gotta see me for some Pilates. I was gonna say, if only I knew someone that taught Pilates, it would be helpful. Oh right. And then, you know, just the the creeping wave of fascism in our country. That's just that fascism. They just, you know, just inner inner rotation. In rotation, yeah, just like spin the wheel. What's gonna what's gonna wake me up? Make a deal spin the wheel. Hip? Hip cat fascism? Fascism and hip cat.

Julia 4:20

That sounds like a band. Hip cat fascism. Cat fascism. Yeah. Yeah, I find cats are um really interesting, you know. Like I haven't, I don't have cats, but I've cat sit on many occasions, and they have like an entire nightlife that I do not understand. Um and they can be so evil. Like keeping you up, bopping you in the head, bopping you. Do you get bopped? Do they book?

Mike 4:48

I don't he doesn't necessarily, but he's like, again, he's a like will like suffocate you with his body. Will like wedge his body into your breathing apparatus, so you're like inhaling cat fur. Fair. Yeah. So it's no way to breathe. And then yeah, there is a whole there is a whole nightlife. There's like a whole it's like a whole studio 54 going on for them every evening. Truly that is unknown to humans. We are not privy.

Julia 5:18

It's the uh, it's the the what was it, the hip cat fascist?

Mike 5:23

Hip cat fascist.

Julia 5:24

Yeah, keeping you up.

Mike 5:26

Yeah, yeah. Hip cat fascist.

Julia 5:29

Your journey as a writer and educator is uh multifaceted. What first drew you to storytelling and how has your relationship with writing evolved over the years?

Mike 5:42

Oh gosh. Wow. Deep. Well, as you know, we I began my career as a performer.

Julia 5:50

Yes.

Mike 5:51

And as often happens, you move to like a larger city, you know, and you want to like sort of get into like the professional world, and you become disenchanted, or either or you make it. Some people I've heard are very successful at it. I don't I don't know them. And then or you become disenchanted. So I became very disenchanted with, you know, and I think also too, uh, which happens for a lot of people that are starting as performers or or want to be in the arts, you kind of feel some people are confined by the fact that, like, oh, here's the script. You have to say these words in this way, and that's all you can do. Whereas other people are like, you know what, I kind of want to like make up my own words. So they become writers or you know, they get into improv or whatever, they want to direct, like they want to, you still want to craft a world, you still want to entertain, but you want to maybe do it from a less strict box. So I think that's what really started my writing is that I had been disillusioned with performing, but I also still felt like I wanted to entertain, to contribute, and you know, live a somewhat artistic existence. It was also, and I started writing like a lot of like sort of nonfiction essay stuff. It was also the time when that was like really big. Like when I was like the like very the NPR, like David Stare, all of that stuff, Sarah Vowell, all of those sort of uh David Rackoff, all these sort of essayists that were like really sort of having a moment. And I was like, that's look seems like fun. Like maybe I should try to like funnel my personal experiences into some sort of entertainment like that. So that's where I started, and then I just haven't really stopped.

Julia 7:36

That's how it happens.

Mike 7:38

And then I ended up, which is also what happens when you are directionless. I ended up getting a master's degree. Yes, you did. Yes, I did.

Julia 7:44

Because Yeah, let's talk about that for a moment. Because when did you how old were you? How old were you when you got your masters?

Mike 7:51

Older than a lot of people. I was like in my early 30s, like I started the program. And it was yeah, so I was like a little bit older than I didn't go right from obviously from undergrad, so I had a little bit of wisdom. I was not the oldest one in that program, obviously, but I was definitely like straddling a line. So, you know.

Julia 8:09

Yeah, what was that like?

Mike 8:12

It was fine. Again, I I the program I applied to a couple of programs. The one I ended up going to was at City College of New York, Go Beavers, because well, it was, you know, cheap. And no, they had a great English program. And I actually I ended up actually not getting I got accepted into the creative writing program and the English Lit program. And I ended up doing the English Lit program because they had a uh this joint degree semester abroad where I got to go to Austria for Oh, yeah, that's right. So that's kind of why I took that program. And then I actually technically now have a advanced degree from overseas as well. So maybe if I flee there, I can use that to teach in a college overseas.

Julia 8:55

I mean, put that in your pocket. You may need it later.

Mike 8:57

Yeah, I I seriously might. So that's why I and full circle to fascism. Full circle, full circle, full circle, full circle circle. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so that's how that all happened. And then, you know, I kept writing. I became involved. A good friend of ours, Kelly Jean Fitzsimmons, runs a storytelling series called Know You Tell It. And I was involved with that for about a decade, helping other people sort of craft their nonfiction stories. So, you know, lots of different ways to kind of plug into that world.

Julia 9:27

Yeah. And I enjoy your writing.

Mike 9:30

Thank you.

Julia 9:30

You're welcome.

Mike 9:31

Thank you.

Julia 9:32

Books have clearly been a through line in your life. What kind of books feel essential now, given you're now in midlife and what's going on in the culture?

Mike 9:43

I hit that wall again. Well, first of all, during the pandemic, I had a real problem with reading. And I still have not clawed back to like pre-pandemic, I was like, oh, looking at like I would read between like and this might be to some people this is a lot, to some people this is not a lot, depending on where you are and what you're doing. But I read like between like 40 to 50 books a year.

Julia 10:05

At some point in my book, that's a lot.

Mike 10:09

But then I see some people are but then I see some people, they're like, Oh, I only read 60 books this year, I only read 75. And I'm like, how how? So anyway, I was like that was like the high water mark. And then the pandemic happened, and I lost my attention span and I couldn't read, and I did not enjoy fiction, and I would get very distracted. So I'm still sort of like clawing myself back from that. So and then I've I've, you know, you hit you have this realization, or I think a couple times, maybe through life, I had it previously where you're like, I'll never, I'll never have time to read all the books that I want to read before, you know, I'm dead. So I don't know, Michael. I'm not sure that's like at the top of everyone's list. I didn't say everyone, but I think people have that thought of like, oh, I'll never like there's all these movies I'll never get to watch. There's all these like this things I'll never get to, you know, there's like a bunch of books that I'll never get to read. So that's it.

Julia 11:00

I love how your your your measurement for your own mortality is the amount of books that you are not gonna be able to read, which I appreciate.

Mike 11:08

Or like things you would consider, you know what I mean? Like they're like and sure, it could could be for other people, could be travel, could be like I'll never there's a you know, yeah. These are the countries I'll never make it to before I like yeah. So so I'm kind of in that place of like, oh, there's I have like the list of books that I think I want to read, and then I never like get to them. So I'm just trying to, but do you want to know that like in terms of content? I I'm all I'm still all over the place. I'm very like I'm very like well, what feels essential right now?

Julia 11:38

I mean, you're you're always recommending books to me, you know?

Mike 11:43

I mean, I think I definitely have gotten to a place. I don't know if I can say what feels essential, but I will say that like if you're reading a book and you do not enjoy it, put it put it aside. Walk away. I used to I used to never be able to do that. I'd be like, I've gotta, well, I gotta finish this book. It's only 600 pages. No, put it aside, walk away. Again, limited time on this earth. You don't know when your number's up. Put the book aside, start something new. If it's not, I mean, again, you gotta give it like I always say you gotta give it 25, 50 pages to like, yeah. But if it's after that, you're like, this is a slog, and you're not required, like there's not a gun to your head, just throw put it aside, find something else.

Julia 12:21

That's really good advice because I think um, I mean, I often feel really I feel shame or like guilt when I can't get let it go. You're so right. But I I think I told you previously, like I've been I've been rereading Clive Barker's A Magica, which is you know, some it was originally, I think, three books, and they put it, you know, into one book. And I want to say, you know, I don't even know. I think it's like 600 something pages, maybe more.

Mike 12:48

Yeah. He's he's either he will either write like 99,000 or like five, yeah, like 5,000.

Julia 12:54

There's no yeah, it's uh, but I I love it. It has taken, it's taken me months to get through it, you know, and it had it's interesting because it was three books previously. So it's got its ups and downs, and you know, moments where I cannot focus and I'm just like, all right, get on with it and I'll skip. I find that I have to skip, like I can't read every single sentence if I'm bored and I'm just like, well, that's just is what it is, right? You know, but then last night I was up for like an hour and I had to put the book down because I was like, I'm gonna go to bed. But yeah, that's a good, it's a good point. And I also find that I'm really gravitating toward fiction lately more than anything, because I need some kind of escape. And as a working in my industry, it's like everything is like I have to read this self-help book or like this book on technique that I need to learn about and educate myself. And I'm just burned out on that, I think.

Mike 13:44

Yeah, you want to go to the imaginary world.

Julia 13:47

Imaginary world, the fiction. The fiction.

Mike 13:51

Yeah.

Julia 13:51

Yeah. We've seen a lot of music together, Mike Dressel. Everything from uh, you know, Tori Amos to Justin Vivian Bond, which we you know saw a few months ago. What music raised you? What music held you together, and what are you listening to now?

Mike 14:10

Okay. Well, we have seen a lot of music together and like good bands because who knew they'd come through Florida, like Orlando. Yeah, in the 90s in Orlando, and also for like a nickel. For like a good nickel. You look at tickets prices now, and it's like people are like selling harvesting organs to like go see, you know, Taylor Swift or or Harry Styles. And back then we were like, here, here, kid, here you go. Let me get into this band.

Julia 14:36

See, and by the way, you and you and Tom, your boyfriend, see a lot of music together, like much more than I could even he is that is his like outlet.

Mike 14:46

Because again, yeah, let's I don't want to give away too much, but he works as a lawyer and he has a very stressful job, so he needs like, and that's like how he wants to spend his disposable income and time. And so yeah, yeah. So by virtue of that, I've definitely seen more bands, more pop bands than I would have or have seen in a while. So, but in terms of like what raised me, I was not like hip when I was like this it's shocking. This is this is gonna come as a shocker. So brace yourselves. Prior to like high school, I was not like really into music. So like I didn't, you know, like my parents had in retrospect, my parents had some really great like vinyl, like they were like my dad had some great record collections. He was, you know, he was all over the place, but he had like everything like in the 60s and 70s, like when everyone was like, it was some Dion Warwick, he had some Sinatra, he had ABBA, he had the Beatles, he had Dylan, like all over the place. And I was like, but we were not raised, like we never heard that. My sister and I in the house, we didn't hear a lot of like pop music. So I had a terrible taste, terrible taste. Like I this is embarrassing. The first like CD, remember, like you used to buy CDs and they come in those long boxes?

Julia 15:59

Oh, yeah, yeah, because it had all the like all the insert and all the stuff for it.

Mike 16:04

It was like they didn't just sell it in the thing, it was like a rectangular cardboard, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, my first CD that I remember purchasing with my own money, like with my allowance, was Millie Vanilli. Of course, which is not a real band. I mean, I guess it's it's music, but they weren't really Milly Vanilli wasn't real. So that feels like a that might be like a cheat code for for me for like a second. Like, oh, that's not a real, we gotta go back to the well and find something that's real. But then I I I did improve through like high school and like more socialization and friends and like you sort of absorb influences. But even then, I was into like I gravitated to weird things. Because if you remember in the like nineties, this you're gonna have to edit this tangent down in the 90s. There was like a lot, there was like the swing revival, but there was also that lounge exotica revival. Oh, I remember. So, like I was like, I mean, I was never like super into grunge because that was very aggressive. You know what I mean? Like, I liked obviously like you can't escape, and I like Nirvana and I like I love Courtney Love, I love whole. Yeah, but I wasn't super into like some of the other like you know, bands. So I really gravitated to like the weird like exotica lounge swing, weird, like weird shit, and uh just like weird stuff because you could I mean listen, I don't want to sound like an old an old fart, but I do think the 90s, like I do think Gen X is like the best, and I like a lot of the stuff that we had a lot of problems, we have a lot of problems, but I do feel like there was like I don't know, like uh the music was dialed in.

Julia 17:41

I music was dialed in. There was such variety, you had 120 minutes. Jeff Buckley, okay, you know, you had Jeff Buckley, but then you had like squirrel nut zippers, right? So we were like listening to acoustic one night, then you're out like swing dancing, which is completely the antithesis. Then we're like going to like a ska concert, and then I'm at a rave, and then you know, and yeah, and then we're sitting back at our apartment, like smoking a marrow on a cigarette, listening to Gypsy Kings or Gypsy Kings, or like um I'm trying to think of like a lounge band. What combustible? Or like G11 special, G11 special sauce.

Mike 18:19

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Julia 18:20

A dusky Martin and Wood.

Mike 18:23

Yes. So yeah, like there was just like this, it wasn't so siloed. I or at least we were open to more multiple sort of channels, I think.

Julia 18:33

Yeah. You know, so and you had to work harder to find them.

Mike 18:37

Yes. Yes. And like, so yeah, I and also this was the sort of like high point for magazines. I read a lot of music magazines. I would read, you know, obviously everyone read Rolling Stone and Spin, but you'd read like Magnet and Alternative Press, and like then there was also all the alt weeklies. Orlando had the Orlando Weekly that would have like great reviews and you know, like yeah, yeah.

Julia 19:01

So like you I just felt like And we still had MTV, which was MTV and not MTV TV shows.

Mike 19:08

120 minutes, 120 minutes, yeah. Great way to just like you know, you're down in the background and you're just like ambient, like absorbing all of this great music. So yeah.

Julia 19:20

When you think of like well, I was gonna say when you think of maybe like a tougher time in your life, what can you remember like a specific like band or album that really helped you kind of like keep was it was maybe maybe like the glue that sort of held you together? I mean, pick one.

Mike 19:36

Um yeah, I pick pick which time and which time um which time which one? I feel like if you're going through a breakup, you should always put on Fleetwood Mac. Oh yeah. Stevie. Stevie will get Stevie, Stevie will get the witches. So listen to some Fleetwood Mac, listen to some Stevie Nick's solo records, like that will that will take you through. That will get you there. I there's also like albums that I cannot, for various reasons, cannot listen to again.

Julia 20:04

Yeah.

Mike 20:04

Like I had there was a very specific period of my time where like I associate with that, which and I love this album. I love it so much. That PJ Harvey stories from the city, stories from the Oh my god, but I can't put it on, can't put it on again. I'm just like too, it's just like you know, takes me back to like this really weird place. So I can't, and then there's some artists that are just canceled. We we shouldn't. We I like God, I would love to listen. Ryan, just you're doing yourself no favors. You're doing yourself no favors. Morrissey, Morrissey, god damn it, sir. Damn it. Like, uh, I'm just like, come on, man, come on. Why? Because this is the the trajectory for a lot of white British rockers is that they just go super racist at a certain point. They're like, you're like on the on the road, and they're like, Do we keep being cool or do we like take the racism exit? And they always take the racism exit, like fucking Clapton and Van Morrison, like just fucking chuds. Yeah, so yeah, like come on, it's a Morrissey.

Julia 21:11

I'm always like, oh, yeah, you're like the Smiths take me back, but God damn it.

Mike 21:17

Yeah, I'm so mad. So yeah, like I cannot. And like you can get like here's the thing in the in the comfort of your home, it's like shame eating. If you want to put on a Morrissey record, if you want to listen to Ryan Adams, that's little Michael Jackson. Sure, sure, do it. Like no one's gonna know, but yeah, it doesn't it doesn't feel great. No doesn't feel great like it should.

Julia 21:40

No, and it's you're so right. It's like it's that feeling after you eat like a bag of Oreos. Yeah, you're it's like uh I uh I thought it was good while it was happening, but now I feel bad about it.

Mike 21:51

I should have just made the healthier choice.

Julia 21:53

Yeah.

Mike 21:54

Yeah.

Julia 21:54

What are you listening to now? Like what are some I do, I was speaking.

Mike 22:00

Of Morrissey, because I was thinking about this. Yeah. If you have not heard Hamish Hawk, he's a Scottish singer. Okay. Scottish singer, but he has like that Morrissey voice, but he's less problematic. Without being a dirtbag. Yeah. If you need like a less problematic Morrissey, I would recommend Hamish Hawk. He has some really, really good albums out. I was also listening to I was thinking of like witchy things for this, since this is ostensibly supposed to be a witchy. A little spooky.

Julia 22:28

Yeah.

Mike 22:28

Jonathan Holton.

Julia 22:30

Let me let me just say, uh, listeners, that I get most of like probably 90% of my music recommendations come from you and our very good friend Jason.

Mike 22:40

Jason.

Julia 22:41

Yeah. I um come I come on very come to very few things myself. So everything that Mike Dressel is about to rattle off right now, I will not know, but continue.

Mike 22:49

Like Jonathan Holton is doing some like spooky goth folk. Love. And he's got like a whole look. It's like there's a whole persona. It's very good.

Julia 22:58

Okay.

Mike 22:59

You've probably definitely heard of Last Dinner Party.

Julia 23:01

Of course I haven't. You have.

Mike 23:03

They're British, they're they're ladies. If you like the kind of Florence in the machine, of course. Yeah. Then I think you would like Last Dinner Party.

Julia 23:11

Okay.

Mike 23:12

Okay. And then there's this group called Haute and Freddy. Like Hote Couture. Houte and Freddy. They're they were songwriters, apparently. And then like they've wrote pop hits for a bunch of people. And now they've like putting out their own music and they're very like chaperone.

Julia 23:25

Love it.

Mike 23:26

So those would be like things that I've and then you know, like I just go back to like listening to all the the stuff that I the classics. The classics, you know. Because sometimes like I want to lock in to a new band or a new scene, but again, as I as I said, I'm oh I'm old, and sometimes I'm just like, I don't know if I can give this what it needs. Like it's a lot of work. I gotta I gotta, yeah, it's gotta go. So I will also say tangentially, there's a lot of pop stars, and I was never like a pop person anyway, like pop pop. I was more like like we discussed, I was listening to fucking 1960s lounge music. So but there's a lot of pop stars now that are just I call them like they're like white noise pop stars. They're like algorithm pop stars that like you tell me they exist, but I don't believe you.

Julia 24:18

I always think you know, because if everyone out there doesn't already know, but I am a I'm a Pilates instructor. I teach group class once a week. I three teach three classes in a row once a week on Wednesdays. And I always think it's like whatever songs I hear when I put like the pop channel on during those classes, I will recognize all the music, but I will not know who the hell sings it and I won't know anything else about them.

Mike 24:40

No, again, it's it's white noise. Backgroin back just said back groin, back groin. You're back groin. I pull my back groin, my front groin, pull my rub my front groin and my back groin. It's hurting me. No, but like you're like again, somber, sure. Tate McCrae, whatever. Benson Boone, right, gotcha. Whoever these people are. These are not, you're not real. You're not real. Addison Ray, sure. These are not things. Now, I uh because you know, I am a homosexual, some of the homosexuals worship these people in a in a you know, they deify them to, you know, I guess to for whatever. But I don't, again, it's just like it's just I don't, I think they were like they're they're from the simulation. They're AI generated. They're not, it's I can't, it doesn't, they're not real. It doesn't hit. You don't get it. I don't see it. It doesn't hit. It doesn't hit.

Julia 25:29

I I find that like when I'm trying to listen to new music, it's gotta have, it's gotta pull me in right away, or I'm done. Like I it's gotta like crack something open in me, or I'm just I'm not interested these days. And even then, can I tell you how many albums I download into my library and forget I have? And then I'm like, what is this? Oh, I downloaded this, like, and a lot of it's uh you know something like I get like all these bands you just rattled off. I'm gonna download all of them and I won't remember a single one, and I'll probably not listen to them.

Mike 26:02

Fair, fair.

Julia 26:03

And you don't have to elderly, it's also the elderly.

Mike 26:06

Also, we don't have to keep up with the Joneses anymore. We don't have to be like cool. We can just, you know, I don't have to be like, you know, I don't have to be 50 years old at the railing of the Addison Ray concert going, Yes, queen. I just like it's fine. I don't have to be that. And if you are that person, that's fine too. Live your truth. Live your truth. Namaste, walk, walk your path.

Julia 26:31

Can I see your mug?

Mike 26:33

Yeah, it's the my my my golden girl's mug. Just given to us by another friend of ours. Sorry, I had to I have to keep the the pipes lubricated or else this interview will go to.

Julia 26:45

Well, for a moment I thought maybe it was from your your shop because I don't a lot here. Let me talk about this for a second because I had no idea that my friend here, Mike Dressel, had like a t-shirt shop until I was on his website looking at stuff for his writing. And then it was like, go to my t-shirt shop. And I don't think any of our friends even know that you have the t-shirt shop. But the let me just say so. The tagline is Camp Cult Retro and Queer Designs for Living. It is exactly perfect. So I would like to know what the fuck? When did this begin? How is it going? I will definitely purchase some shirts now that I'm aware.

Mike 27:26

It was completely as like an exercise, an experiment. And I will say that it is it does not generate a substantial amount of income. You know, none of these like online things do because it's not, it's it's through a T public. So it's like you put the design up and then they take like 99% of the profit, and then you get like a nickel. Here you go.

Julia 27:46

But by the way, I will put the link in the show notes because you should all check it out.

Mike 27:50

It's so shit. Part of the reason it was like, you know, like you're like, God, I really wish I had a t-shirt with X on it, and they don't exist. So it's like, I'll make it myself. Yeah, I got Canva, I'll make it myself. I got Photoshop, I'll make it myself. Yeah. So that's kind of what how it started. It was like, I want to like make I want a t-shirt with these obscure things on them, and perhaps other people would like it as well. Yeah. And then some of them are just also like weird slogans or ideas or things that just amuse me that I that I was like, I'm gonna make a t-shirt of this. Like it's like the idea, it's again you talk about things that keep you up. If like a f if like a phrase or something is uh locked in my brain, I I got I gotta purge it. So like some of them like put it on a t-shirt. Yeah, Patty Dukes of Hazard.

Julia 28:43

Doesn't get better than that.

Mike 28:44

Patty Duke with the Dukes of Hazard Love Go. Yeah, or Johnny Cash, which is like C A C H E, like binary ones and zeros. These things just had to be like deleted from my gray matter and put on a shirt. And that was the way that I had to, yeah. So I just put him on a t-shirt. Put it on a t-shirt, put it on a t-shirt.

Julia 29:02

Put it on a t-shirt. Yeah, I mean, I was looking through, I love like the outrageous fortune shirt. I I there are so many good things there, especially if you're like a Gen X type person. There's like a lot of fun shit there. But then there's also like, I mean, I think you've got some John Waters stuff, like some other, I feel like there's some pink flamingo action there somewhere.

Mike 29:21

What I've also, yeah, but like also like I like to like, because sometimes I'm bored at work and there's a lot of like I like to find a lot of like archival imagery, like stuff from different places that it's either public domain, all of this is public domain, don't sue me. You know, or like archival or public domain stuff that I can then sort of remix. Yeah. Because if you notice, there's a lot of like doodles and remixes of the like image. Yeah. So that's part of the that's part of the thing too.

Julia 29:48

I think it's great.

Mike 29:49

Fun remixed of yeah, lots of pop culture, lots of pop culture.

Julia 29:54

But you know, the one thing that was missing though, I didn't I was really shocked that there wasn't any kind of like David Lynchian moments. And I was there's only one surprise. Really?

Mike 30:07

There's there's there's a wild at heart share it.

Julia 30:09

Oh, I missed it.

Mike 30:11

Yeah, it's very because again, I didn't it doesn't have a lot of embellishment, it's just kind of the the logo for the logo.

Julia 30:19

I mean, I feel like David Lynch feels like the page the patron saint of the liminal space, like given that you know, he's like he was into he was rest in peace. Rest in peace.

Mike 30:30

He's still he's out there, he's still floating around.

Julia 30:33

I believe that wholeheartedly. I mean, he was you know, with the transcendental meditation and all that kind of stuff. I really feel like he knew what was going on.

Mike 30:41

But yeah, someone just bought his house, sorry, sidebar. Did they? You know, his con yeah, someone uh like because that house was for sale, the the the one that he lived in, which was also at the Lost Highway house.

Julia 30:51

Oh my god.

Mike 30:52

I think someone bought it in Hollywood, so but like not disclosed to the buyers yet. So someone's a fan.

Julia 30:59

Yeah, someone's a fan.

Mike 31:00

I mean, I sorry to derail.

Julia 31:02

No, not at all. Do you feel like he influenced you like artistically, existentially?

Mike 31:09

Yes.

Julia 31:10

Yeah, same one.

Mike 31:12

Um I will. I was like, well, I was gonna say, I was like, do I do we talk about the movie that we saw together in college? Which one? When we saw Lost Highway.

Julia 31:23

Did we see Lost Highway together?

Mike 31:25

Yes, while we were also Did we drop acid? Yes, we did.

Julia 31:29

Did I drop acid?

Mike 31:31

Yes, yes, that one. You say so which I haven't I've only watched, I think, one other time since then. Because that one's a mind trip, but I did just last week, because again, it's blisteringly cold out, and I don't want to be outside. So I'm like re-watching a lot of like stuff. Everyone's like, watch this new show, and I'm like, no, I'm gonna rewatch this movie that I like. So I rewatched three David Lynch in the course of I rewatched Mul Holland Drive, Inland Empire, and Blue Velvet.

Julia 32:01

And yeah, I think Blue Velvet for me is the like the way in for like what like initially like stuck for me because again, I'm and Kyle McLachlan is so hot and like young, he's so good in that.

Mike 32:15

Yeah, yeah. I mean, and it's just the idea, like I because again, we grew up in the weird Gen X and like grew up in the 80s, and thinking about like the sort of Cold War era, and like you know, there was that nostalgia for the 50s where like everything was and we if they keep coming like uh the the fascists and the republicans always go back to this well, right? They always want to go back to drink for that well that like the 50s, right? The white picket fence, the 2.5 kids, nuclear family, blah blah blah, which we all know is like a construct and and and effecsimile.

Julia 32:47

And I think that you know that was and underneath it all is just misogyny and patriarchy and ego.

Mike 32:54

And violence and you know, decay. Yeah, so but I think that movie is like Lynch doing that at his best. Like that's definitely like a bugaboo for him because of obviously Twin Peaks, too. Like you're like this small town, and then like underneath is all of this sort of the wacky violence and like misogyny, like you said, and just you know, degradation of women.

Julia 33:14

So yeah, I mean it starts with murder, it starts with it's rape and murder, like that's the the theme.

Mike 33:20

Yeah, but they're also good people too. Like there are ways to be good and ways to be, you know, but you can't ignore the shit that's under the surface. You can't ignore the evil or the violence or it festers. Yeah, you have to like come to terms with it, right? You have to like sort of, you know, sunshine's the best disinfectant, right? Bring it all out. So yeah, yeah, man. Yeah, man. Yeah, man. So yes, he's definitely and you know, definitely, definitely an influence. And I feel like again, someone you can go back to and uh see different things because he's not interested in satisfying your narrative itch.

Julia 34:00

Absolutely not.

Mike 34:02

If you need like that narrative itch scratched and you need it like wrapped up in a bow. No, but conversely, my my favorite TV show, I love like the Law and Order SVU. So, like, which is scratch is that itch, which does like tie it up in a neat bow. And like, so like I have like the two sides. I'm like, I need just complete like you know mental exploration, and I need like let's wrap this up. I need a satisfactory ending, I need you know, the good guy to win, I need evil to be punished.

Julia 34:29

So yeah, I mean there's some there's definitely a vibe with David Lynch, and I there is like an itch sometimes that I need to scratch, and I definitely will go back, especially to watching like reruns of the original Twin Peaks, like the show, you know, up until a certain point, because when he stopped writing for it, which I think was like the which season?

Mike 34:49

I don't second season, but second season, but I don't know.

Julia 34:54

The early episodes are the best episodes, yeah.

Mike 34:56

Oh yeah.

Julia 34:57

But back to your point about Gen X. Let's talk about that for a second. So yeah. Yeah, we were basically like feral, raised on caffeine and neglect and left alone with our thoughts way too early. So what do you think that actually taught us? And what are you what are you trying to unlearn? Like, what do you think it taught us and what are you trying to unlearn?

Mike 35:17

I mean, I do think that we were I was parented, but I was not helicopter parented. You know, I was definitely raised. We're like, go out and play, you know. I don't need to know what you're doing, I don't know you need to know where you are, you know. If you're like, and then it got to, you know, to like when you're a kid, you're like riding your bike, and then it was that thing of like, all right, sun's coming down, that's when you come home, right? Yeah. And you're sort of left to your own devices. And then even in high school, when I like started going out, and like my parents were very good about being like, look, you can go out, hang out with your friends. I need you home by this time. If something happens, you know you can always call us, we'll come pick you up, no questions asked. That kind of very like good parenting, you know what I mean? Like, obviously, like some things, you know, you can still cause them disappointment and they can still be upset. And like if you're like, if you come home like drunk or like whatever, you get arrested, they could be bad at you. They should be mad at you.

Julia 36:11

But but you know, you had enough sort of lead to like to fuck up, to get a little lost, to to make mistakes. Yeah, yeah.

Mike 36:22

Yeah. So I think that was like part of the thing. Like I said, we're not we weren't, we didn't have a GPS on us. Our you know, we weren't like we didn't have to text our, we didn't have phones to text. We didn't have phones to text. So we didn't have to be like, text, text me when you get there. No, it was like we're gonna just either uh your parents dropped you off or you they just assumed that you got there. And then yeah.

Julia 36:40

Yeah, until you did until you didn't come up.

Mike 36:42

Until you didn't, right? Because we also grew up in the 80s and there was a lot of child snatching.

Julia 36:47

It's a lot of milk cartons with faces on them.

Mike 36:50

A lot of white vans circling the neighborhood. So if you didn't make at home, well, that was the price of that was the price you paid.

Julia 36:56

Yeah.

Mike 36:57

Do you want to have fun? Do you want to make at home? We'll see.

Julia 37:01

Don't talk to strangers.

Mike 37:02

You're not, yeah.

Julia 37:02

Don't don't take the candy, don't get in the van.

Mike 37:04

Don't take the candy, don't get in the van. Yeah. Don't pet the puppy. Yeah. So I definitely think that, yeah, we were. And then also this is the same thing.

Julia 37:15

We have more self-reliance. Like we just got a lot. We we were raised with a lot of self-reliance. But what do you think you're trying to unlearn?

Mike 37:22

Now this goes back, this is sort of uh on both sides of the line. Because one thing that I also think back, this is back to like it's all tied together, algorithmic pop stars and like poptimism. And I feel like the not selling out thing was actually, I think we can go back to that a little bit. Like, remember, like it was like the the most taboo thing to like sell out. Like, yeah, you're a sellout man. Yeah, like you wanted to do it for the love of the game. And I feel like that could become a jail. Because then, you know, I mean, like that was a prison that we you know, some people put themselves in. But I also like that's not entirely wrong because now everyone just wants to sell out. Yeah, they're like, how can I sell out as quickly as possible? Yeah. And it's just sort of like, are you in it for the love of the game? Are you in it to like actually do something? Or are you just trying to like get your bag? Which fine, you know, but like not everyone's there's only so much bag to go around. You're not all gonna have the bag. So what how did so are you fulfilled or are you just gonna like what are you left with if you didn't get that bag? How do you how are you satisfied?

Julia 38:30

Yeah, I feel like it's a delicate balance, right? Because, you know, there's like some, I don't know. I feel like it's always a fucking car commercial. And it's like a car commercial, and it's like, oh my god. It's it's like uh, you know, Fleetwood Mac or something, it's like a song and it's a car commercial, or it's somebody else. And I'm thinking to myself, I'm just like, you know what, get that money. Yeah. I'm like, get that money. Yeah. Mainly because this is you know, a band that was around for so long, and they're just now like, okay, they're like their music's in a car commercial, they're like in their eight, their seventies, or like whatever it looks like. And I'm like, whatever. Like, get get that money. Like, but when but like running, rushing right into it.

Mike 39:11

Like, I think like with Stranger Things, like when Kate Bush, you know, running out that hill, like, sure, like when that direct deposit hit, bless. Good for you, you know, that a million dollars direct deposit.

Julia 39:21

Get that money, yeah.

Mike 39:23

But it wasn't like she was taking meetings with Netflix going, You gotta get I got a song.

Julia 39:29

I got a song for you. I got a song, I got a song for you.

Mike 39:32

Like, that's what it feels like now. Everyone's just going around hat in hand, like begging to sell out. And it feels kind of, and again, that's just the ethos we were raised with. Like, I remember there was like it was the Burger King commercial that used I'll melt with you.

Julia 39:46

And like people were like, What?

Mike 39:50

Like, how dare you? And like that you could not explain that to someone now that like that was such an affront. Now it's like, yeah, oh my god, they got it in that Burger King commercial. Wow. Like, you know, advertising was like not something that you supported. It was like, why are you trying to like sell me things, man? Yeah. And now it's the opposite.

Julia 40:14

Even now, I think, you know, doing what I do, I struggle a lot. I get a lot of you know, emails like for influencer like opportunities, and it feels and I like I need the money, trust me. Like I, you know, but I um it feels so weird, and I'm trying really hard to kind of come around to a place where like I can represent like certain products as long as like I believe in them. And even then, it feels so weird, which is odd because if I were still an actor, you know, and I were doing commercials, I'd be like, who knows what I would be selling like tampons.

Mike 40:48

I don't know, but yeah, but it used to be when you did commercials, you would that was like you would get residuals, like there was a whole like infrastructure to and that's even gone away. So yeah, now they're just trying to get you to do more for less. Oh, but that's true too.

Julia 41:04

Yeah.

Mike 41:05

If you got a shit ton of money for like talking about a feminine hygiene spray, and you're like, that bought my vacation home and that sent my kids to private school, sure, great. Yeah, but now you you're like, well, I just got a free case of feminine hygiene spray.

Julia 41:18

Yeah, a lot of them they just want to send you free pro I mean. Look, those I'm just like absolutely not when they were like, Well, I'll give you free products. I'm like, I have enough crap.

Mike 41:25

I don't need more crap. Right. I don't need more crap. I don't need more crap. I want better.

Julia 41:32

I'm gonna shift gears, Mike Dressel. Let's talk about gay culture. Oh gay culture has shifted fast and not always gently. Um yeah. What parts of gay culture do you feel nostalgic for? And what parts are you genuinely relieved to leave behind?

Mike 41:53

Oof.

Julia 41:54

I know it's a lot. I have feelings too.

Mike 41:56

A lot.

Julia 41:57

Yeah.

Mike 41:57

I will say I am grateful for prep and for the ability for people to have sex without like as much stigma, without as much fear, without, you know, the ability to like you know manage your own health in that way. So that's like huge. That's huge. And that, you know, there was like a lot of like controversy around that when it first came out, too. But you think of the generation before who would have like done anything to have the ability to like take a pill or an injection that would, you know, prevent them from catching HIV.

Julia 42:36

So which would prevent you from death.

Mike 42:38

Yeah. And though, even though now death, you know, HIV is not a death sentence, you know, undetectable is untransmittable. Untransmitable. Wait, yes. Yes, yes. So I'm like, wait, you equals you. So like there's all of these things that, you know, there's still a lot of places where people can be, you know, a little sticky, but I think that's like a certainly a win. A win. That's definitely a win.

Julia 43:02

And also we should say too, something that comes to mind, you know, is that we wouldn't have had the COVID vaccine as quickly as we had if it wasn't for HIV and the work that was being done on HIV.

Mike 43:13

Yeah. So and we still need to we're the work's not done yet, unfortunately. Like we need to we need to finish that. Uh, we need to get that across the finish line. But I do think that men and women are now able to, and everyone in between are now able to make choices and control their their health and their sexual health in a way that we didn't have as many options before. Agreed. I'm like, brother, brother, bright up. Um and then what did you what was the other? What did I miss?

Julia 43:42

A second part of that question was like, what are a couple of things that you would that you genuine you're you're relieved to leave behind where you're like, I'm glad that's we don't we don't do that anymore.

Mike 43:53

Yeah.

Julia 43:53

I mean I mean, I if you're if you're struggling, I have one, like I think um you're yeah. Well, I think we're much more, and I should by we, I mean like as an ally in the community with, you know, all of my friends and my chosen family. You know, I think there's more inclusivity when it comes to non-binary people, when it comes to people transitioning. There was a time when there was a lot of judgment within, I think, gay culture in certain circles, like around all of that. Oh, so I would certainly leave that behind.

Mike 44:26

There still is. And of course I'm I'm very happy to like, but again, there's always been a divide between there's always people that wanted to sort of assimilate, that wanted to be very heteronormative, that wanted to be, you know, accepted. And then there's there was the ones that were on the forefront that were just, you know, living their life as they wanted to, and it didn't matter if they were accepted or respected or looked at in any other way than how they wanted to be presented. So I definitely think we've we've left a lot of that behind, that sort of gatekeeping of gay culture. But it it's always gonna be, it is ever thus that you know, people are gonna try to like exclude the other or try to make someone else the other so that they can rise above and be, you know, seen as and here's the thing if you're a gay person, queer person, and you want to ally, ally, align yourself with the Republic, they don't like you, they will never like you. You're never gonna be good enough for them. You're never gonna be in. And they the minute you're not useful to them anymore, they will kick you to the curb. So you better get down here in the gutter with your sisters and your brothers, the freaks, the real ones, because we're the ones that were gonna take care of you. That's how I feel. That's how I feel. Yeah, you can't, you can't like, you know, you're not gonna please them. You're not gonna be, you're not gonna get their approval. No, and it's weird.

Julia 46:04

I mean, I'm not sure if your life I think we can all, we all mean you and I, can agree that it is it's always strange to see someone on that side where I'm just like, how does that work? How does that work? I mean, I feel the same way about you know, women, and by women I mean like cisgendered women who are Republicans or who voted for Trump. I don't get it at all. I don't get it at all.

Mike 46:28

Right. They're not they're not here for you. They're not your friends.

Julia 46:30

They're not here for you. No.

Mike 46:31

Um they will not support you, Michael. Yeah.

Julia 46:36

You're dating a younger dude.

Mike 46:37

I am dating a younger dude.

Julia 46:39

Which here at Agecraft After Dark, we think is fabulous, and we do not judge. What has this relationship revealed about aging, power, desire, or cultural expectations, especially as a queer person navigating visibility and relevance?

Mike 46:53

That was a very long context. Well, I will say uh so my yeah, my boyfriend's younger, he's in his 30s, and you are in my late 40s.

Julia 47:05

Late 40s.

Mike 47:06

Uh and no, so his he's noticed that his friends are starting to sort of tap out of like being able to like hang later or go to events or whatever. And he's like, it's weird. And I was like, it's gay aging. We're gay, you're gay aging. So you're aging, you're aging, you're gay aging, you're gay aging. So like we we keep it, we keep the party going for much longer than the heterosexuals. So, like, like, yeah, yeah, we look younger, we keep the party going, we're able to like, you know, just maintain our lifestyle. So, yeah, he's like, my, my, my straight friends can't keep up. I'm like, it's all right, baby. You're gay aging, you're fine, you're fine. Other than that, the only other thing is like I'm old now and I do not like to be out late. I I think so. I'm sometimes a rave widow. Like he'll be like, I'm going out. And I'm like, that's great. He's like going out at 11, and I'm like, that's great. I'm gonna go to bed. I'll see you.

Julia 47:59

I'm gonna watch some Netflix chill up and uh cuddle with the dog and the cat and uh and uh yeah, go to bed.

Mike 48:04

So that's the only thing is that I still I he still likes to to go to that like dance, dancy dance things.

Julia 48:12

Yeah, but you navigate it fine. I mean, every time I talk to you, you're like, he does he does his thing and I'm doing my thing, and like it's fine. Yeah.

Mike 48:19

We we're we're we're very good about like and then we there's a lot of things we enjoy doing together, so it's fine. But yeah, I just I feel like you're given a finite amount of years or months or days or whatever in your life that you're allowed that you can stay up past 4 a.m. And I think I used all mine up. I between the ages between the ages of 18 and like 30 something, I used up all my staying up late time.

Julia 48:43

Yeah.

Mike 48:44

And that's it. Like my passport was revoked, and I think you're now you're now a person who goes to bed at a sensible time. I'm sorry. And that's fine. That's fine. I'll accept that. I'll lean into that. Totally. Uh what was the what was the rest of that question?

Julia 49:00

Um, I mean, I think you answered it. You know, it's just basically like what is it revealed about aging, you know, power, desire, cultural expectations. You know, I I mean, I don't think any I I could only speak for myself. I mean, I have no judgment, you know, when I see the two of you together, I have nothing to say about it. I don't think so.

Mike 49:16

Um well, half of his friends did not think that we were much different in age when they first met me. Yeah.

Julia 49:22

So uh you look so young. So yeah.

Mike 49:25

So virile, so young. So virile, so young, so potent. Um yeah, so again, gay aging. So yeah, it hasn't really created any kind of like cultural again, you know, we're close, we're more closer in age than we're not.

Julia 49:41

Like, you know, I also think, well, let me ask you this. Uh sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off, but um I also feel like it's more acceptable in the gay community than it is in the straight, like heteronormative community. I think there's a lot more judgment, or do you think that's wrong? That I'm wrong in saying that.

Mike 49:58

I don't think you're wrong. And this actually goes back to what you were talking about before that previous question about sort of gay culture and leaving things behind. Yeah. In the 80s and 90s during the height of the AIDS crisis, uh the desired figure, and this is still sort of always ever the evergreen, but was like the young per the young body, the slim twink, yeah, hairless, yeah, because that youth and that virility was something that was being taken from, it was ebbing away, it was dying. And so you didn't have a lot. We growing up, and I know I've talked to this, talked with some peers about this, didn't have a lot of examples of intergenerational gay gayness. Gayness, queerness, yeah. Of queerness. Like it was, you know, very much because a lot of a large majority of that generation had passed away. You know what I mean? You didn't even have a chance to really kind of and then it was sort of looked down upon. So I I definitely think you know, we're seeing it more now, and it's better that you know, there's we're gonna have to like cut this a little bit to make this make sense. I think edit this, but I you're seeing more examples of it. You're seeing like there's there is less of a taboo about it. There's less of you know, and we have a lot of the same reference points and touch points anyway, so it's it's not weird. And I don't know why it would be, you know, it's not like you know, it's not like the stereotype or the like the way that it might be presented in like media or something, where like, oh, sugar daddy is just you know going after the the young thing.

Julia 51:50

It's give me the loot, yeah. Yeah, get the bag.

Mike 51:54

You gotta get the bag. Get the bag.

Julia 51:56

Get the bag. Yeah, yeah.

Mike 51:59

Yeah.

Julia 52:01

You and I are both medicated, Mike Dressel.

Mike 52:03

Yeah, I love my I love my Zoloft.

Julia 52:06

Somehow that's still it feels still like transgressive, you know. You I I the f I mean, look, I feel like you and I started our medication around the same time and you were calling it your buying pills. So whenever I think about it, I'm just taking my buin pills. I gotta take my pills. You know, how has aging changed your relationship with mental health? And what's the most exhausting myth people keep clinging to about mental health? Do you think?

Mike 52:30

Uh I mean, honestly, I wish I would have taken those buin pills sooner. Saved. Could have saved. Could have saved. Listen, was I self-medicating a lot because I was not taking my SSRI? Not like prescribed anything? Yes, probably. Yeah. Like, was I using alcohol as a way to kind of like do what these pills are now doing? Yeah, yeah. And did that, you know, end up with me in some not great situations? Sure. So I'm definitely, I definitely should have been on these much sooner. And yeah, I don't, I don't know why there is still a stigma about these, you know. And there definitely is. I've definitely seen, and like if you look online, if you spend any time online, there's definitely people that are reactionary and be like, the worst thing you can do is take these pills. And they're like, the the pharmaceutical industry is just blah blah like no. This is take the tell. Definitely, definitely, definitely, definitely has kept me more sane and balanced and happier than I've been in a while before I was on it. So yeah, I I don't understand the I don't understand the negative reaction to it. And again, it doesn't, it's not the be all and all thing too. You should still take a hike, exercise, eat right, do all the things, drink water. I don't know, you know, but at the end of the day, sometimes you need a little extra.

Julia 54:00

A little extra help.

Mike 54:01

A little extra.

Julia 54:02

I think about that a lot. I mean, I, you know, it's not any pill, anything that you're taking is never gonna be a magic bullet. Also, we are certainly living in a time and place where people are over medicated, right? So there are some people out there who are taking too many things. There are some people out there who they take one thing and they think that's gonna fix everything. And it's like you said, you know, it's you still have to do all the other stuff and like the lifestyle change or you know, whatever that's gonna look like in addition to it. But same as you. Yeah. I mean, I th I was depressed, I think, for so long, and I had no idea like how I I think it was like once I started, I had that moment, this eureka moment of like, oh, like is this how people feel most of the time? Like kind of happy or at least not sad, and they're able to like focus and do things. Like, is this what I could have felt like for years and didn't because I refused to take medication?

Mike 55:05

Right. And you definitely like I definitely had that baseline when you know I was like a kid, right? An adolescent and teens or whatever. I wasn't super depressed. I had like a sort of you know, highs and lows like everyone else.

Julia 55:18

And I was like everyone else, yeah.

Mike 55:20

After like being on, you know, the the Buin Peels for a while. I was like, oh right, this is kind of like the baseline that I used to have. Right? Like, I'm like, I still get depressed, I still get angry, I still have you know bad days, but it's much easier to like come back from that. It's much easier to like there's more elasticity in my like return to more resilience, more resilience to like return to a baseline. And I'm like, oh, right, okay. It just gives you more if you're able to come back, if you have more resilience, so able to come back to that baseline, it just it gives you better, you know, base to deal because the world sucks right now. There's terrible things happening, and you know what? We need you, you listeners, watchers, we need you on the front lines, and we need you able to like coping and capable, cope and capable of coping and capable, yeah, marching with us, you know what I mean? So like take care of your mental health and do what you need to to show up, yes. And don't feel bad about it, and don't feel bad about it. That's my PSA.

Julia 56:24

Yeah, uh all right, everyone on Agecraft After Darkest 2, tell a spooky story. It can be a literal haunting, but it doesn't have to be. We're just as interested in the high strange moments of Kismet, eerie coincidences, or that one time you followed a gut feeling and it absolutely saved your ass. So, what story would you like to share

Spooky Story

Julia 56:47

with us?  

Mike 56:48

Okay, no, this actually is, and my sister remembers this better. Um, but it was so when we were young, we used to spend most of our summers at my grandmother's house in North Carolina. And, you know, other kids would go like, we're going to Europe, we're going to, well, we're going to grandma's, you know, like that was our spent a lot of summer at grandma's. And she lived like in the country. It was in in in North Carolina, but it was not like super, super like hill people country, but it was a two-lane highway that she lived off of. Very sort of isolated. And there's always like shenanigans. There's always like nefarious doings in and around this place. And like I would also Gen X.

Julia 57:29

So, you know.

Mike 57:30

But like there was always be like, and because it was a two-lane road, there used to be a lot of people drag racing down the road. So you'd wake up, you'd hear it overnight when you're trying to go to sleep, and then you'd wake up and there would be like empty beer bottles that were chucked out of the car. And it was just like a weird, like sometimes there were bullet casings.

Julia 57:46

So there was there was always people are shooting guns. That's what they do. They're shooting guns, chucking beer bottles. Woo-hoo.

Mike 57:52

And I would always like have a weird, like I felt like I was very like in tune to like the spirit world back then. And like there was always like weird things. Like, I definitely saw a ghost one time. There was this mother and daughter that were dressed. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Like fully like wandered through the living room and like they were in like sort of like Puritan-esque garb.

Julia 58:15

In your in your grandmother's house.

Mike 58:18

Which and this house was built in the like 40s or 50s. So it wasn't like it wasn't like the 1800s. It wasn't like they were like, but they were there. And then there were other times where like there would be I felt like there was a like the lights, like the alien lights, you know. Because again, this was the 80s and this was Gen X, and like that remembered.

Julia 58:39

Hello.

Mike 58:40

There was that book, what was that? Whitley Striber or somebody like Communion or something.

Julia 58:44

Um oh uh Communion, right? Communion. Oh, Christopher Walken was in that movie. Yeah, do you remember that?

Mike 58:50

Yeah, so there was a lot of so I anytime I would see like weird lights, I was convinced it was aliens.

Julia 58:56

Aliens.

Mike 58:57

But there was one particular night, I think it was in the summer, and it was my mom and my sister and my grandmother and myself, and we were there, and it was late. Like we were we were gonna go to bed, and there was like a banging on the front door. And again, this is the kind this is the south. So like relations use the back door, use the porch, right, to come into the house. Uh-huh. So the only one that would knock on the front door was the front door.

Julia 59:23

Yeah. Yeah.

Mike 59:24

You know, you only use like the main is like a stranger. So like this bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang. And we're like, okay, like we all get very like concerned and scared. And someone's like asking for help. They're like, we need help, we need help, we need help. They're banging, and we're like, okay, and we look out and we, yeah, and we look out and we don't really, and again, I'm gonna massacre the story, but like we look out and we don't really see anyone out there. And then we notice there's this truck that's out there that's like running, like big pickup truck, like ignition cars running, and like they're still banging. We're like, okay, we're gonna we're gonna call the the police because this is how again, my grandmother's house, like I said, is in this area that's very isolated. And so, like, if she would come visit us for a while, inevitably we would come back and the house would be broken into a lot of break-ins. So it's like we're like the sheriff was on speed. So I was like, We'll go have to call the sheriff again. And like they would always come down and like I remember more than once there was fingerprint dust on several of the fucking surfaces. So we're like, we have to call the sheriff. We also called her brother-in-law, my my great uncle Cliff, to come down because he lived up the road. Because again, it's the south, everyone's up the road, everyone, everyone's family is up the road. So he came down and you know, and was trying, and he was like, It's at some point, he was like freaked out because he looked inside the truck and there was no one there. And then we just he was he came in, he was like, Get down, you know. I think you should get down. And at some point there was like bang, there was just banging on all the doors. We just heard like the whole house was like surrounded by like bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang.

Julia 1:00:56

And then we heard the truck like he didn't see anyone, we didn't see anyone in the truck, but it like peeled off, and the sheriff showed up, and they finally and they couldn't find anybody, and it was just like this weird this experience of like something, somebody was happening banging on the door, then banging on all the doors in a mysterious truck that was not piloted or manned by any human.

Mike 1:01:21

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And yeah, and then again, the great uncle, the great uncle was freaked out, like, and he like you know, is like a the skeptic, the big guy, yeah, the mainly guy. And like he was freaked out, and like yeah, it just was very, but again, on par, freaky, scary, could have died, but on par with generally like most of my experiences in that house, like weird stuff, weird shit, weird stuff. Yeah, call the sheriff, go have uh got a break in, gonna have to call sheriff, gonna have to call the sheriff.

Julia 1:01:55

South is a weird place. I feel like um lots of freaky things. I mean, so many things from my childhood, your childhood, but even you know, Florida. Um people consider it the South, some people don't, you know, in a way, but it's definitely parts of it are definitely oh it is a feel very weird.

Mike 1:02:12

It's a game preserve, it's just wild animals crawling. Yeah, yeah, there's weird stuff. Yeah, come on.

Julia 1:02:18

Yeah, but this was wait, but this was in where again? South North Carolina or North Carolina, yeah. So I mean, you know, it's definitely the south.

Mike 1:02:24

Definitely, definitely the south, and definitely just weird, weird stuff. Weird stuff.

Bibliomancy

Mike 1:02:30 Julia 1:02:31

Well, Mike Dressel, we have reached the end of the interview and it is time for Between the Lines. This is our Bibliomancy ritual. So, Bibliomancy, for people who don't know what this is, is a form of divination where a book is opened at random and the words on the page are taken as insight for the moment. You'll hold a question quietly in your mind while I do the reading. And once we're done, you'll reveal the question and we'll talk about what came up. Okay. Now, before we begin, you get to choose a book. So I've got two books to choose from. One is orthography, an illustrated guide to bird lore and symbolism, or floriography, which is an illustrated guide to the Victor the Victorian language of flowers. So you get birds or flowers. You got to tell me which one you want to do.

Mike 1:03:17

I want bird lore.

Julia 1:03:19

Bird lore. Okay.

Mike 1:03:21

Bird lore.

Julia 1:03:22

Grab that. So we're going to do ornithography right here. All right. So I'm just going to hold this book here. You're going to think about this question.

Mike 1:03:33

What kind of question? This should just be like a general sort of it could be anything. Okay.

Julia 1:03:40

Since we're going to discuss it, you know, in public, maybe, maybe not something too serious or deep that you don't want people to know about would probably be. Right on. Yeah.

Mike 1:03:49

Yeah, yeah. Okay.

Julia 1:03:50

Okay.

Mike 1:03:51

You let me know when you're ready. I'm ready. Okay. All right.

Julia 1:04:02

You got the jacana. This is this is what this this bird is. I I don't know. I've never heard of. And the meaning, the meaning of this bird is a miracle. Jacana's, and I I don't know if I'm saying this right or not, is a long, wait, Jacana's long slim toes allow them to balance on lily pads and other floating vegetation, giving the appearance of walking on water. Because of this, they are sometimes called Jesus birds, in reference to the biblical story in which Jesus walks on the Sea of Galilee.

Mike 1:04:37

Oh, is that a good thing? Thanks.

Julia 1:04:41

Thanks for that. Chicana young are cared for by their fathers who scoop them up in their wings and carry them away whenever danger approaches. This causes the adult males to appear to have manly, spindly uh, have many spindly legs, a bit like a supernatural half spider, half bird. So they have spindly legs. What did that bring up for you?

Mike 1:05:05

What do you you want to know what my question was?

Julia 1:05:07

Yeah, well, tell me what your question was, and let's discuss like what how this all fits together, if at all.

Mike 1:05:14

My question was, how will my sense of style evolve?

Julia 1:05:22

It's gonna be a miracle.

Mike 1:05:24

It's gonna be a miracle. I'm gonna walk on water.

Julia 1:05:26

You're gonna walk on water.

Mike 1:05:27

I'm gonna have spindly legs. So so what it's telling me is that skinny jeans are back. What I'm hearing is skinny jeans are back and also messianic delusions. Delusions. We're gonna walk on water and skinny jeans are back because it's you're gonna save us from fascism. With spindly legs. Spindly legs, skinny jeans. Okay. That's what I'm hearing. What I'm hearing is skinny jeans are back. Thank you, birds.

Julia 1:05:52

Yeah, I think that's what they're saying.

Mike 1:05:53

Thank you, Jesus Bird.

Julia 1:05:55

You're welcome. I'm glad that we could sort that out for you. Uh we do here at Agecraft After Dark. We sort of. Sort out all of the uh the tough questions. Well, Michael, this was so fun, so good. Love you so much. So glad you did this with me. Thank you so much for being on my podcast. Tell people where they can find you, how they can find your work, where they can find the t-shirt shop with all the fun t-shirts. Tell them all the things.

Mike 1:06:19

Yes. The easiest is just go to micdressel.com. You can also go to my Instagram, which is Instagram slash what is it, MK D R S S S.

Julia 1:06:29

Are you asking me? Because I don't know.

Mike 1:06:31

I I think so. I'm let's just go with that. And that has the link within that, one of those link trees that has a link to all the places. But those are the best. That's the easiest. MikeDressel.com.

Julia 1:06:42

Mike Dressel.com.

Mike 1:06:43

Um and I will For all your needs.

Julia 1:06:45

Yes. And I will put all of these links in the show notes in case any of you miss that and you want it and you just want to click on it, I'll put them in the notes. So yeah.

Mike 1:06:53

Drop it in the notes, along with the many corrections we're gonna have to issue for all the erroneous statements I've made.

Julia 1:06:59

I don't know about that. Well, maybe. We'll see.

Mike 1:07:02

We're gonna see who's litigious.

Julia 1:07:06

God, don't say that. Well, if only, you know, I have to be honest with you. If only this podcast would be so successful that I would be sued. So yes, why not? Why not, Mike Dressel?

Mike 1:07:15

This is for entertainment purposes only. You cannot sue us.

Julia 1:07:18

Please do not, yeah.

Mike 1:07:19

Or maybe do.

Julia 1:07:20

Or don't. Or don't.

Mike 1:07:21

Or don't. Or don't.

Julia 1:07:23

Mike Dressel, thank you so much for being here.

Mike 1:07:25

Thank you. Hey. Bye.

Julia 1:07:30

Agecraft after dark is written, produced, and edited by me, Julia Granacchi. The music Bernard Bernard Brunett by Ivy Virus. Have a question or a spooky story? I want to hear it. Leave me a message at speakpipe.com forward slash agecraft. And you might just hear yourself on the show. For more agecraft content, join me on Substack at agecraft.substack.com. If you'd like to work with me and learn more about all of the things, head to juliagwellness.com. Thanks for listening. Remember, visibility is activism. And until next time, stay curious, stay a little haunted, and I'll see you in the dark.