Huzzah to All the Boyz

In this episode, I’m joined by my dear friend and esthetician Jason Moyer for a conversation about midlife reinvention, non-binary identity, and what happens when your creative self kicks the door back open and says, “hi, remember me?” We get into turning 50 and somehow feeling more like yourself, the magical world of smut, good sleep, and nice d*cks, and why liberation makes some people deeply uncomfortable. And of course, we spiral (joyfully) into a deep dive on Heated Rivalry.  

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Transcript

Opening

Speaker Box

Julia 1:17

There's a very specific kind of frustration that comes from knowing exactly what you want to do and still not doing it. Not because you're lazy, not because you don't care, but because you're overthinking it, waiting to feel quote unquote ready, or quietly avoiding the one thing that would actually move things forward. So I made something for that. My spring reset, get out of your own damn way workshop, is a 60-minute, no bullshit reset designed to help you actually do something with all of that awareness you already have. Now, this isn't about becoming a new person. It's about clearing a path for what's already trying to emerge. This is for you if you've been about to start something for, I don't know, longer than feels cute and you can't get to it. If you're ready to stop circling and actually move, you know, come join me. Because honestly, you're probably not stuck. You're just in your own way. We'll cover your personal self-sabotage style because yes, you have one, why motivation isn't the problem, the identity you've probably outgrown but are still clinging to, and a simple way to release patterns that aren't working anymore. You'll leave with one small doable action that creates actual momentum. It's happening April 30th at 6.30 p.m. It's live. There are guided exercises, a replay if you can't make it, and it's $29. To sign up, go to juliagwellness.com. That's juliagwellness.com. I will, of course, leave this information in the show notes. Are you haunted by the thoughts that show up at 3 a.m.? Good. This is where we follow them. Where science meets ritual, humor meets reckoning, and aging and identity are viewed as evolution. And where we ask the only question that matters. And I know that's, you know, part of the theme of the show, but I should be more specific, less about getting older and more about who will take care of me when I'm old, which honestly is not a question I remember hearing much about when I was younger, or maybe I did. And I just assumed there would be like a system or like a plan, like a vague invisible safety net that would somehow catch me. But given there's very little infrastructure in this country when it comes to supporting people, families, and so forth, I think that it should be no surprise that there really isn't anything in place. And as I get older, I'm starting to realize that this is really something I have to start bringing my attention to, you know, and kind of think about. And I should add that my husband and I are child-free by choice. Now, we love our life, we love our freedom, we love our sleep, you know, not saving for college, all of that is amazing. But I think that the idea or the question of who will take care of me lands a bit differently when you are a child-free person, because there's this cultural narrative that says, you know, that your kids are going to take care of you when you get older. And I don't know who needs to hear this, but that is not a retirement plan. That is a very hopeful suggestion at best, because let's be honest, there are no guarantees. Not everyone has that, you know, relationship, not everyone lives nearby, not everyone is able or willing to step into that role. And so, really, all of us, whether you have kids or not, have to consider this. And when you really get to the root of it, it's not necessarily who will take care of me when I'm old, but will I be alone? And every time I start to drift too far down that path, I keep coming back to the same thing. And that is community, chosen family, people we gather around us, not because we're supposed to, not because we share DNA, but because we see each other, because we show up for each other, because we decide again and again, you matter to me. I choose you. And that kind of care, it's built over time in conversations, in small gestures, in being willing to witness each other through all the weird, liminal, in-between versions of ourselves, through tragedy and grief and celebration. And, you know, it's not something that you want to suddenly be thinking about at the age of 80. It's something you need to start practicing now. And I think that this culture is very good at emphasizing romantic relationships, but not emphasizing other relationships, which are equally important, if not more so in many ways. And that brings me to today's guest. Because when I think of the people in my life who feel like anchors, who feel like part of that future I'm quietly building, this person is one of them. And I know this got very serious. And we are gonna have some laughs today, I promise. And in fact, before we get into the interview, let's see if someone's come in through the speaker box. 

Speaker Box 7:12

Knock, knock, anybody home. It's Mother Witch. This is Mandy Holmes. And one thing I never expected about getting older or when I got older is that I would embrace linen as a perpetual goth kid. I never thought that linen would be a thing that I now require as part of my soft pants collection. So I'm very shocked by that. And really loving how comfortable linen pants are.

Interview

Julia 7:49

Hello, Mandy. Thank you so much for calling into the show. So this is how it happens. One day you're a perpetual goth kid, and the next day you're like, but is it breathable? Linen is like the gateway fabric to aging with dignity and adulting commitment to comfort, is what I would say, right? It's giving soft pants, but strong boundaries, and I respect that deeply. As I've gotten older, things that bring me comfort have gone from like, hmm, that would be nice to have, to being a fully non-negotiable thing. Like I will absolutely spend extra money on bamboo sheets without a second thought. In fact, Quints, which they don't sponsor this podcast, I wish they did. Maybe they will in the future. That would be great. They make the most amazing bamboo sheets. We have like three sets, and I did not even blink twice at the price tag when I got them. Do I care that this is who I've become? I do not. I care that when I roll like a sleepless alligator at night, it's on the softest breathable sheets. So, Mandy, the point of what I'm trying to say is I fully support your linen era. This is not a betrayal of your goth identity. It's an upgrade. Soft goth, breathable goth, but still goth nonetheless. Now, dear listener, if you would like to leave me a message through the speaker box, you can do that by going to SpeakPi and, you know, share an observation about getting older, identity shifts, health. Maybe you have a question for me, whatever strange realization has been keeping you up at night. That's what I'm here for. That's what I want to hear. You know, keep it short and your message may be played here on the show. You can leave your recording at speakpipe.com forward slash agecraft. That's speakpipe.com forward slash agecraft. Today's guest is Jason Moyer. They have been many iterations, including actor, writer, producer, and the list goes on. And they admit that they wrap their identity in those drawings. But for now, they're just a happily married person enjoying life as best they can. You can currently find them writing poetry in their notes app on their phone, sweating happily on a dance floor, or laughing wildly at a golden girl's reload.  Hi, Jason.

Jason 10:19

Hi, Julia.

Julia 10:21

So good to see your face.

Jason 10:24

Oh, it's good to see your face. Your hair looked amazing.

Julia 10:27

Thank you. I have to say the Dyson hair wrap has changed my life.

Jason 10:32

Dyson makes good products.

Julia 10:34

It's a little bit like of a learning curve, but once you figure it out, it's it works really well. It works really well. All right. Well, before we spin off onto that tangent, I'm gonna have you introduce yourself by saying your name, your age, your pronouns in whatever order, and then what's been keeping you up at night?

Jason 10:55

Okay. My name is Jason Moyer, and I'm already already telling people that I'm 50. I'll be 50 in two months, but it's just easier than saying, oh, I'm 49, but I'll be 50 in two months. So I'm 50 and I am non-binary. I use all pronouns. So whatever you want to call me is fine. Typically out in the world, because I am mass presenting, I get a lot of he him, sir, which is great. I don't care. My all of my gay friends use she just because we're gay like that, but I'm open to it all. There is like a place of privilege for that, and I do like to acknowledge that. So yes, there we are.

Julia 11:38

Yes to all of that. Where what's been keeping you up at night? I am I forgot my own question.

Jason 11:44

I was thinking about this question. So not to make uh women of a certain age feel bad, but I'm actually having the best sleep of my life. So there is nothing that's really keeping me up at night, but put aside America, I'm gonna put aside Middle Eastern Wars, I'm gonna put aside genocide, because all of those things are just this constant background stress, and I think everyone is feeling it. So putting all of those things aside, the thing that's keeping me up at night is actually super positive. I've been going through in the last few weeks, do you know how everyone talked about their midlife crisis? Yeah. Um, I think I think that we have to get out at some point of our midlife crisis, and I'm kind of like in a midlife revelation.

Julia 12:37

Yeah.

Jason 12:38

Um so I've been coming back to like who I was before and who I want to be in the future, and spending time with the things that I really enjoy and just rediscovering who I am now and picking all the parts that I liked and bringing them with me.

Julia 12:59

I love this for you. And I would add that I'm glad that you're having this experience because it's very similar to the experience I had when I turned 50, which was very different from the experience that I had when I turned 40, which was a total breakdown, meltable, like melt face, you know, existential crisis. This was like completely different and so positive and very similar to your experience. And so I say huzzah to that.

Jason 13:27

Huzzah, yeah, it's been really great.

Julia 13:30

I would also say that it's really been on my mind lately, this idea of thinking about who we were, who we were when we were born. What is the what are these things that we have taken through our life, like this accumulation of our life into who we are? Are we really ever arriving at a particular place? I'm not sure that we are. I don't feel like I am. I feel like I'm constantly searching, but I feel like the older every year I feel like I'm getting closer to who I am. And I feel in this moment that I am the most to me that I've ever been in my whole life.

Jason 14:02

That's an amazing place to be. I don't know that I'm there yet, but like I I actually really like who I am right now and am focusing my attention on loving that person more and trying to just be happy with myself.

Julia 14:16

I mean, I've always liked who you are, so I'm here for the ride, no matter what.

Jason 14:20

Thank you.

Julia 14:21

You're welcome. And I also I I also want to add that I too am having the best sleep of my life.

Jason 14:26

Oh, well, I'm glad to hear that because I know for a while it wasn't the case.

Julia 14:29

It was not, I know. I d you know, 50 also brought better, yeah, better sleep.

Jason 14:35

I I mean you know me, and you've known me for 30 odd years, and we've lived together, and you know how I love to sleep.

Julia 14:46

Yes, like it's a hobby.

Jason 14:49

And I'm good at it once I fall asleep. Now, for years falling asleep was the problem, is I could not fall asleep. Um, and now that I I've been going down this journey about figuring out my own neurodivergence, and I realized that that's a problem for a lot of neurodivergent people. And I would start ruminating while I was asleep, or trying to fall asleep, and then that would turn into anxiety and that would turn into a panic attack. But I'm on a good sleeping pill and it knocks me out in like five minutes. And so those things don't happen, and I sleep well and I wake up like ready to go.

Julia 15:28

Yes, yes to all of that. Uh again, I couldn't say, yeah, I like for you know, as a woman, it could be like hormonal. I'm not taking, but I, you know, I'm not taking like a sleeping pill, but I'm taking hormones and that's like helping.

Jason 15:39

I would imagine, yeah.

Julia 15:40

Yeah, I'm happy, I'm really happy about that. And and and every time it's good, I think, well, will it last? I don't know. Hopefully. Hopefully. Where are you right now in the liminal space of aging and identity? And by that I mean like, do you feel like anything's ending or beginning or emerging? I mean, very much to what we were, it's very connected to what to what we've been talking about already.

Jason 16:01

Yeah, it's very interesting. Coming on what I would consider like a landmark birthday, the the big zeros are they weigh on you a little bit and the positive and the negative. So definitely have been thinking about it a lot. I also went through this experience earlier this month where I got caught up in a lot of my feelings, and it was over issues that I thought I had already resolved. And so part of that was damn it, I didn't resolve it the way that I needed to. And I love that the universe is like, here, you think you got it down, but you really didn't. So let me show you how you didn't get it down. But there was a night that I was really in my feelings, and I was sitting on my couch, there was a little crying happening, and I was just reading some of my old poetry, and especially some of the poetry that I used to like perform, so that I used to speak out loud, and uh I started just reading it aloud to myself. There was no one else in the house. And by like the third poem that I got through, like literally I felt like something like crack open. And it was like it was like me coming out and going, where have you been? And what have you been doing? And all of this energy that you've been uh putting into these different things, it's just your creative energy that you haven't been using, and you need to use your creative energy again. So literally, like the second that that happened, I stopped crying, I stood up, I turned on some music, I cleaned the house. I was, I was like, if you could like flip a switch and change someone, it happened that quickly. And that's where I am in the liminal space, just enjoying who that person is.

Julia 17:54

I feel like you had like a nervous system reset in that moment. Do you know what I mean?

Jason 18:00

It was a nervous system reset, and it was also a mindset shift.

Julia 18:06

Yeah.

Jason 18:07

So that was important. There was like I I was looking at it from a new vantage point where I was like, oh, that's a new perspective. I I haven't looked at myself that way, like uh an analytically. Who is it?

Julia 18:21

Or like it's been a minute.

Jason 18:23

Yeah. Is it what's her name? Marianne Williamson, you know, she's kind of a crackpot. I'll say that out loud. I I, you know, 16 years ago, yeah, I went to her course in miracles a lot of times, and it helped me at the moment. But she said that a miracle is just a shift in perception.

Julia 18:40

Yeah.

Jason 18:41

And so, like, I really felt like at that moment I was experiencing a miracle, which was really cool.

Julia 18:46

That's very magical. And yeah, few and far between, but those moments should not be taken for granted. And I feel like you can name them whatever you want. It really doesn't matter. All that matters is that the outcome was positive and that you were able to do something with that. And you've been writing more, and you've been sending me your poems, and they're fucking fantastic.

Jason 19:05

Thank you. I'm really happy with what I the work that I'm doing right now. And that little shift that happened was really trying to reclaim my creative self because I think we've both kind of done this. You know, we met doing theater, getting our theater degrees, and we worked as performers and directors and writers and in creative spaces for a very long time. And we've both kind of had a shift where we're not in those creative spaces anymore. So I felt like I had to reclaim my creative energy that I was putting into so many, actually, so much obsession, I think, over different things of just because that energy wanted to go somewhere. So it would like spin tales and tell stories and like focus on something it didn't need to focus on. So yeah, I really enjoyed the things that I'm writing right now, inspired to like create another show that I want to do and just kind of remember the badass motherfucker that I was and the things that I could do. Still are and do them again. Yeah, exactly. Still are.

Julia 20:10

Nothing's changed.

Jason 20:10

I mean, I wasn't for a while. I I I really think I got lost sight of a few things for a while, but she's back.

Julia 20:17

Yeah. I I I definitely relate. I made a promise to myself when I turned 49 that I was gonna buy a keyboard and learn how to play the piano. That has yet to happen. But you know, okay, first of all, I learn everything the hard way. We'll put that to the side. But I do things like when I'm ready to do the things, and I have come to a point in my life where I'm like, it will happen. It's not happening today. I will find the time, I will make it happen. But I have this feeling that when I finally do that, something I hope, I feel something magical is going to happen when I when that day comes.

Jason 20:50

Yeah, I think it's honoring where you are. Like I'll know, like I'll talk with this whole shift. It's been like it's in every aspect of my life. Like I'm going to the gym every day, which used to be a struggle for me. I know it's crazy. And like apart from going every day, I'm actually enjoying the process of going because I know that it's like something for me and I feel good about myself after I do it. And I think for a long time I felt like maybe I didn't deserve to feel good about who I was. So then I didn't enjoy those things.

Julia 21:25

That's so interesting to me because that is what I want for everyone. Like activity. And when I say activity, I mean, you know, the stupid thing to say would be like fitness, but I would say activity. So whatever you're doing to stay like active, whatever that looks like, it should feel good. And that's what I tell all of my clients. And I've written about this and I've talked about it on social media. I don't care if you do Pilates, I don't care if you strength train, I don't really care what in the ever-loving fuck you do. Just pick a thing that you enjoy and do it consistently and let your body just feel good. And I am so thrilled that you have found a thing or or like reframed, figured out a way that this is feeling different in your body. And I, yeah, Hazan.

Jason 22:05

Yeah. It's really kind of fucking cool. I'm really enjoying it.

Julia 22:10

So these are we're talking about like a lot of shifts, I feel like.

Jason 22:13

Yeah.

Julia 22:14

And you and I both had major career shifts later in life, with I which I'm very proud of both of the of us for. So let's talk more about that. Tell me what happened, what you were doing, what you decided to do, and how that all sort of came to be.

Jason 22:30

Oh gosh, that's like a really layered story.

Julia 22:34

So that's what we're here for. The layers.

Jason 22:38

I tried to work for a long time in the creative entertainment industry here in Los Angeles, primarily trying to focus on acting, but I did a lot of writing and directing and producing. And for a long time, my survival job was I was the manager of a salon, which was great because it allowed me the opportunity to audition when I needed to audition and take days off. You know, there was responsibility, but it wasn't like brain surgery responsibility. Like if I wasn't there, like everything would go on. And a few things happened. A friend of mine. Mine was cast on a a friend that I did sketch comedy with for like 13 years. So like we like shared the same skill set, we like share the same resources, we share the same networking opportunities. She was cast on an NBC sitcom and was there for a few years, which is like the dream job, right?

Julia 23:34

Yeah.

Jason 23:35

And then that show was canceled. And you know, she's booked a few things since then, but then she was back to working a regular job. And I looked at that and I was like, we all hustle to get the job that you just had, and you had it, and that's amazing, and you are wonderful at it, but now you're back to doing what I'm doing. I was like, I don't want to hustle for that. I I want to like have some security. I want to just like have something that I can do on my own if I need to, when I retire, if I move, have a skill that I could take with me. And so I started looking at the things that I thought I was good at, and you know, being with people and kind of like almost a calming presence and kind of healing environment. I think I'm really good at. And I had I had all of this experience in the beauty industry and had always been interested in skincare once I started working there. And then I was like, I should just bite the bullet and go become an aesthetician. And so I went to school for time, full time for six months and then uh became an aesthetician. And now I work for a dermatologist in Brentwood and do fun things.

Julia 24:47

Fun things. I just what I love about what I love about both of us, I mean, if I'm saying, is that you know, you and I, I feel like when we make these decisions, we go, we're like all in. And to to the extent that you you you were like all in, you you were like the straight A student, you were just like excelling, you know, you totally fully bought in, you got it, you got it done, and like here you are. Um and I I definitely I relate to that and I appreciate that. You don't do things half-assed, Jason. I guess that's what I'm trying to say.

Jason 25:22

No, if I'm gonna do it, I we I'm gonna do it well, and I know that we share that, and that's why we've had so many creative projects together. And like I think why we're such good friends is you know, we want to be the best at what we're doing, and we want to learn as much as we can and you know, share what we can. I think that yeah, I I see that in you, and it's something that I have appreciated in myself.

Julia 25:48

And quite a few of our friends, if I'm being honest, I feel like like attracts like, right?

Jason 25:53

You know, exactly.

Julia 25:54

Yeah.

Jason 25:55

And this is like feeling of being locked in at some point of like this is what I'm doing. And that's where I'm at right now, about like the gym. Just like there's no question I'm going. I'm this is what I'm doing right now. You know, I'm locked into this specific thing that I want. And once we put our sights on, you know, we're both stubborn. You're a Scorpio, I'm a Taurus. We both, once we set our sights on something, we're gonna get it.

Julia 26:19

Yeah, yes, agreed.

Jason 26:22

Especially if we especially I say that, especially if we can control the parameters around which we can work in. Like, yeah, did I want to be like a full-time working actor? Yes, but I didn't control any of those parameters. Yes, like that was not up to me whatsoever. And that was kind of the part that I got sick of too. It was like, yeah, I don't want to have whatever success I could have be in the hands of other people.

Julia 26:48

I also don't want to memorize things.

Jason 26:52

I was thinking about that today because I haven't been on stage since before COVID. And I was like, could I learn a script? I think I still could. But yeah.

Julia 27:03

Could I do I want to? No.

Jason 27:07

Yeah. It's definitely not a skill I've I've kept up on.

Julia 27:11

No, I mean that's like a muscle you have to like build. I feel like it's it's atrophied, you know. I don't know if I could do it. But yeah, I think the difference between the two of us is that I have I often have a very circuitous journey. Like, oh like I'm all in, but mine tends to be mine's usually a little bit more, you know. Yeah, it's I don't know.

Jason 27:33

I I feel that way about myself too. Like I'll set a timeline and that timeline is never right. Like it's gonna take me longer than I think.

Julia 27:40

Fair.

Jason 27:41

Yeah, you gotta you gotta try and fail and then try again.

Julia 27:46

Try again. Also, like, see, don't we don't have so much control over the timeline at times. You know, for example, as I was getting, you know, finishing up my Pilates certification, I tore my ACL and there was nothing, there was nothing I could do. So everything that, you know, the timeline completely got thrown out the window. I had to adapt and move forward in a completely different way, and everything changed, but it really was for the better. Like it turned out really to be like the right timing for me in so many different ways. So yeah, you know, life.

Jason 28:17

Yeah, it happens.

Julia 28:18

It happens. So to the the conversation, you know, about these midlife shifts and sort of later in life shifts, you know, being non-binary, you came out as nine non-binary like later in life. And I feel like I see a lot of that within Gen X because we're a little fucked up. We come to things a little bit slower, you know, to things. I think that's got something to do with it. But, you know, I was definitely, I don't, I wouldn't say I was surprised when you told me, but I was like, okay, you know, like tell me more about that.

Jason 28:50

It's funny because I guess there was kind of a coming out about it. So let's talk about Gen X. Yeah, like we were raised by boomers, and they have no vocabulary for anything emotionally, identity-wise. And that was just the culture. Like, there were no words for certain things, you know. Now we're therapized. Now we, you know, we have access via social media to learn about things. And I so there was a story in my family, which I found out not it was not true, but on my dad's side of the family that we had Native American blood. And so from a like I remember saying it in college, I was like, well, I'm two spirit, like that's how I feel. I never I've never felt like in one place, I've always felt somewhere else, like in a middle stage or like one side and then going back and in and going to the other. So I used two spirit for a while, and then when I did my DNA test, it found out there was no native Native American blood in my body whatsoever. So that was interesting. But then there were words, like now, like the younger generations, there were words for what I was feeling, which was non-binary. Like I have never felt 100 100% like a man or 100% like a woman in my gender gender identity. So I just it was like, oh, there's a word for how I feel. That's how I feel.

Julia 30:16

Yeah.

Jason 30:16

Um, and you know, I don't think it was different in how I actually presented in my life whatsoever. Like, I don't think it was like everyone was like, oh yeah, yeah, you'll wear a dress, sure. You'll wear a dress. Yeah, you're wearing makeup again, great. Like I wore makeup in my 20s, I'm wearing makeup now. It's it's just a thing that I did. So it was just that there was now a vocabulary to be able to talk about it that made sense to me.

Julia 30:41

I think it's the naming.

Jason 30:44

It is the naming, like being able to say this is, and I think it's really important. Uh probably even would be more important if I was younger. But also, like I do know I speak from a huge place of privilege because I can go out in the world and be assumed to be a white cis man and get all of the privilege that comes with that. So, you know, for people claiming another identity or transitioning or any of that, it could be much more difficult for other people. So I haven't felt that difficulty. I mean, because of who I am, being a queer person, being non-binary, I see it happen. And I, you know, also part of my neurodivergence is this fight for justice. So, like, whenever like anything is wrong, I'm like, no, stop it. So for me, it wasn't a huge thing to just say I was non-binary. It was like, oh yeah, that's what I am. Great, perfect. Now there's a name for it.

Julia 31:41

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I definitely got that vibe from you. And and you were very clear, you were like, I don't really care how you refer to me in terms of my pronouns. I mean, you were just like, I, but, but this is how I feel. And I was like, okay, done and done, you know. And interesting that like that the indigenous community had a name for this for so long. And it was nothing really new, right?

Jason 32:03

It was part of their culture and those healers and and and shamans. And yeah, you know, we could go down a long road about talking about how white supremacy is the evil of everything and colonialism and capitalism. But often as I have to do, I'll just leave that in the background, knowing that like it is the root cause of all the evils in the world right now.

Julia 32:27

All of it. I I just don't know why people care so much. Don't they have better things to worry about?

Jason 32:32

That's what I'm worried about.

Julia 32:34

You know, like I just like, why do people care so much?

Jason 32:38

And care about things like literally. So I was at my uncle's wedding. My uncle's only a few years older than me, and he got married when he turned 50. And so I was at his wedding, and my family's from a very small town in Indiana, very rural. A lot of them don't travel, a lot of them don't leave their little communities, so they don't have a lot of access or experience, exposure, exposure to people who are outside of themselves. And I was talking to one of my cousin's husbands, and he was saying something about trans people, and you know, I was refuting it, and but I was also like probing him of like, well, why do you think that way? And then I said, Well, have you ever met a trans person? And he was like, No. And I was like, You've spent all of this brain energy, all of the like angst, but you don't even have any like personal stake in the game. Like it affects you in no way.

Julia 33:34

In no way.

Jason 33:35

Yeah.

Julia 33:36

Not only do you not know anyone, but it literally has nothing to do with you.

Jason 33:40

Whatsoever. Whatsoever. It it astounds me that there are so many people. I mean, I we can all be guilty of it on small levels of things that we like obsess over or fixate on or stress about. But when you look like, you know, I saw some meme the other day, and it's like you are literally on a spinning rock in a universe that we don't know how is created, and you're worried about like pronouns.

Julia 34:05

Yeah. And we might even be in a hologram.

Jason 34:08

So we could be, yep, in a in a computer simulation, like enjoy your life and like let people enjoy their lives. I don't understand why there has to be so much pain.

Julia 34:21

Because women don't run the world.

Jason 34:23

It's just saying this is very true. And we'll go back to that patriarchal white supremacy idea. And like, we got away from a matriarchal society and look at what it's done to us.

Julia 34:34

That's exactly right. I agree.

Jason 34:36

I mean, if we could just have all female leaders for like a hundred years, all problems would be solved.

Julia 34:41

I really feel that way. It would undo so many awful things, and then you know, we'll see what happens after that. And then maybe the aliens would be, you know, they'd make themselves known because they'd realize that we're not a bunch of fucking idiots on this rock. Yeah. That's a whole I mean that's a that's a separate podcast, but yeah.

Jason 34:56

Yeah. If if they had the capability of seeing who were the good people and the bad people were, like just take us, please.

Julia 35:01

Take the button. Put me in a spaceship and take me away. I mean, that's what I'm waiting for these days. I feel like there's no other way out. But I'm I'm trying to be hopeful. Hopefully is an act of defiance. Hope is an act of defiance, and so I am I'm trying. Now, as an aesthetician, uh-huh, you know, you work with people's faces and bodies in a very intimate way. What have you learned from working with trans and non-binary clients about how beauty and identity and gender or genter, genter, gender, gender, gender intersect. I wrote these.

Jason 35:36

It's very interesting because I did not expect like Brentwood is especially known for like it's where all the plastic surgeons are, it's like where all the celebrities go to like get their work done. So working in a dermatologist's office in Brentwood, I didn't expect to have a lot of trans and non-binary patients, and I do. And what has been in what here's what I take away from it is of course there's the magnitude of difference in how their body actually physiologically processes any sort of hormonal transition, how it shows up, a second puberty, like more breakouts. So there's that physical manifestation of it. But the I've been with patients now for three years who like started their transition when I started working there, and like I've watched them over three years. And the thing that I always take away from it is like just this inherent sense of like joy and peace that they found where they can finally be who they are, and they can start seeing a reflection of who they've always felt like they were on the inside. And it's really fucking beautiful.

Julia 36:50

Honestly, why do why would why would anyone want to take that away? Why do again back to the original point? Why do people fucking care so much? I don't get it.

Jason 36:58

Why do people care? Well, I I I can tell you why people care, Julia.

Julia 37:01

Like if you want to know what you'll say, but say it, say it. Okay, yeah.

Jason 37:06

We we are built in this society and this capitalistic colonial society that we live in, especially for straight and sith people. There is a structure of what you are supposed to do with your life to fit in, to be successful. There is from the time that we are born, and they start handing us toys and they start showing us shows, there is a directive of you will do this and you will find the person you love and you will get married and you will go have kids and you will go to church or whatever. Like it is very strict and limiting. And when people who are in that repression see someone else who is going, No, I am not part of that, I am over here and I am liberated because I am part of that. Like I am feeling freedom because I am I'm exploring who I really am, and I'm not going to be tied down to who you tell me I should be. And when people who are repressed or fearful see someone who's experiencing joy or some sort of liberation, they become scared of it. And they start, they start questioning like, why am I having to do this, you know, or or like what would happen if I did that? And it's all very scary. So, yes, can I intellectually understand it? I can, but I also think that most of the people don't even question why.

Julia 38:34

Well, and they don't they don't really know where it's coming from, they don't understand that it's coming from a place of fear. And I would also say projection and jealousy, and you know, and you know, thinking of the long-term effects of repression on the nervous system and on the body and on the brain and what it does to people. I mean, it makes people murder other people. Do you know? I mean, like literally, and what what it just think if everybody could actually just live the life that they want and be who they've always wanted to be, how much happier this entire world would be.

Jason 39:04

Yeah, like they people are tied down to this idea of normal or like this is the way that it should be, but that's just been directed to us to control us. And if you take the time to step outside of it and feel like who you actually are and the joy of it, and you know, maybe you are a heterosexual cis person, and that's great, but you can be an open-minded and liberated person. Like people don't have to have children if they get married. You know, people don't have to get married. People don't need to be in a monogamous relationship if they don't want to be in a monogamous relationship. But the directive from the beginning is always you're going to do these things. So people just assume that's what I have to do.

Julia 39:44

Yeah. I mean, as a child-free type of person, I mean, I certainly I relate to it on that level. You know, the the it can be in, you know, luckily I don't feel that way within our squad, you know, in our group of friends. I don't feel isolated. But I have definitely seen it out there, you know, in the world, the isolation of, you know, for example, becoming a mom and then only hanging out with other moms, losing track or sight of like other friends who are who do not have children. And then also from my perspective as a child-free person, not not experiencing the kind of community that comes with those life-altering experiences, you know, and I don't I don't feel like I need them per se, but I certainly sometimes feel othered by not being a mother because because of the culture, if that makes any sense. Exactly.

Jason 40:38

It totally makes sense. And the other thing is people buy in, oh, yeah, it's gonna be so fulfilling to have a child. It's gonna be like you're you're gonna you're supposed to do it. And I hear so many stories about people who are unhappy that they've actually made that choice.

Julia 40:56

Yeah.

Jason 40:57

It's not that they don't love their children, it's not that they uh like aren't finding some sort of joy in the experience, but like they were like, I I made a wrong choice.

Julia 41:08

That's some heavy shit, dude.

Jason 41:10

It is. And maybe not like the whole choice, but like yeah, people people giving up so much of their life that they didn't want to give up because of this one thing.

Julia 41:22

Yeah, or you're it's like you're sold a false bag of goods.

Jason 41:25

Is that even a is that the right a false sure but it it read right, so that's part big yeah, sure.

Julia 41:32

You know, and I would even add, I would add on to that, like especially with the economics of our country at this moment and the burden that falls primarily on women, and you know, women becoming, you know, the primary caregiver, full-time caregiver, doing all of the work, managing the house, et cetera, you know, and then also taking on the burden of child rearing without any kind of financial support. There are no structures or processes in place to support people or families. And you want us to have more children and take away all of our rights. Like, okay, but what are you going to give me in return?

Jason 42:04

Yeah. If we had a society where, you know, childcare was free, if we education was free, if we had resources for mothers, if we had parent leave time. Healthcare. If we had, yeah, if we had healthcare, then yes, I think people might enjoy that experience a bit more and want to have kids. Yeah.

Julia 42:23

Yeah. I mean, I that certainly played into the reason why I don't have children. I mean, I have a lot of reasons, which I'm going to be writing about soon. Of course, I don't know when this show is going to come out. I may have written by I might have written about it already at this point when you're listening to this. But it's on the list of things. And I'll get in, I'll get more into that. But yeah, all of these things. Now, you know, with your experience as an aesthetician, you know, I feel like the the beauty industry is not always uh very inclusive, as we know. And that means that's more than just gender. I mean, it's so many different things, right? But what changes would you like to see in aesthetics training or practice to better support trans and non-binary people? So kind of like from the bottom up, like what would be helpful?

Jason 43:07

What would be helpful in terms of trans and non-binary people? I think just more education at the beginning of like the difference of not only people's skin, but like the things, the lifestyles that could be incorporated that make the skin look or feel a certain way, uh, inclusion. There's there were no trans uh people in my school to become an aesthetician. There were, I was the only male presenting person in a room full of there were not even any lesbians in a room full of sixth straight women of like 40 women and me.

Heated Rivalry

Speaker Box 43:45

Yeah.

Jason 43:46

Um no trans people, you know, in on the on the cosmetology side, there were there was much more of variety diversity, but yeah, yeah. But in my room, there was none. So I think even just from that foundational level of getting people out there, and it's happening, and I see it happening, but it's still a small, small number of people who are focusing in that area.

Julia 44:11

Yeah, I'd like to see more of it. I one of my goals is to be more inclusive of these communities. I also recognize that people like to work with, get services from people who look like them and people who relate directly. And we need more of that. Like, and I completely understand that it's why I go to a to a female gynecologist and not a male gynecologist. Like, I fucking get it, you know?

Jason 44:33

It's why all my doctors are peer. Like it's yeah. I get it. Yes. And there's like there's an understanding and like an honesty, like, especially being essentially a gay person, like going to a gay doctor and talking about the things that we do as gay people, like having that easy being like, Oh, yeah, I know what you're talking about. Here's how we're gonna fix the problem that you're having with it.

Julia 44:57

Yeah, you don't have to like your doctor knows what prep is, you don't have to explain.

Jason 45:01

Exactly. 

Julia 45:02

All right. Oh my god. Oh, just fix this world. All right. I have something very important to speak to you about, and that is heated rivalry, Jason. Oh my god. Okay. So For those of you listening, Jason has been was after me for for a very long time to watch the show. I mean, in the 2025, like in the, I don't know when in the 20s, but basically as soon as it came out, you were on me to watch it. And I, you know, time, time is the main main thing. But I made it a point and I got it done. And I was so glad I did because it was fucking awesome. And I have so many feels, so many feels about it. But yeah, you start, Jason. You start first.

Jason 45:41

Well, what I love is like you and I really haven't had a conversation about your thoughts on it after. Yeah, we haven't talked about it at all. At all. Um, so I was just sitting on my couch one night and someone on social media posted, hey, there's this gay hockey show, but it was the actual night that it premiered. Oh, yeah. So I was on board from like the very beginning. Yeah. Um it is now like if we talk about like me discovering my neurodivergence and whatever flavor it is, I it is my current special interest. It's my current hyper focus, it's my current obsession. I have I I started watching it again for the 13th time last night. I read all of the six books in the series in a two-week video. Did you?

Julia 46:24

Oh my god, good for you. Reading. Who does that? Reading.

Jason 46:29

And let I I don't, and I'm still trying to figure out why. Like the third or fourth episode, I turned to my husband and I was like, why do I like this so much? Why why do I like this so much? But it just like triggers something inside of me.

Julia 46:46

It presses all the it it checks all the boxes, it checks a lot of boxes, checks all the boxes, yeah.

Jason 46:52

Let me tell you something. I did read all of the books, and it is amazing to me the emotional arc that Jacob Tierney has pulled out of those books and was able to see inside of what was written. The books are smut, Julia. They are smut. And I've read a lot of smut, I've read a lot of like man-loving man books, you know, a lot of gay romance and like sex scenes and books. But this was intense in a way that like almost made me feel embarrassed, and also was too much. Like the the first book is actually, if you've watched Heat of Rivalry, the the first book is the story of Scott and Kip, who are the episode three in the Heat of Rivalry series.

Julia 47:32

Oh, interesting. Interesting.

Jason 47:35

That episode is their full story that's all in that one book. But there was like a night where they have sex for the first time, and they do it like five times, and each one of those is like 10 to 20 pages of talking about how they're doing it. And by the fifth one, I was like, Do I need to read all of this? Like, yes, you like him. Yes, his dick is nice. I understand. I was like, give me give me character, yeah. Uh yeah, so they are smut, but you know, there's a place for it. And I'm it's really interesting to me to see how many straight women enjoy the topic.

Julia 48:15

Yeah, yeah. I mean, to I first of all, Jacob Tierney, you know, you first of all, I'm a big hockey fan, so I'm a big Devils fan. Let we'll not talk about the Hughes brothers. We're not gonna talk about the Olympics and the Hughes brothers. They are they belong, you know, we whatever. We're not we know tough, but I still love the devils and I will show. In any event, so big fan of Letter Kenny, big fan of Shoresy, and Jacob Tierney was on Letter Kenny, and I had read at some point, you know, they were like, they had said, you know, Shoresy walked so that he the rivalry could run. Do you know what I mean? And I definitely feel that way because they're Jacob Tierney definitely took something away from working in that like that community, this group of actors, they're all Canadian, they all have open minds. So all of everything is so good and so inclusive. And the writing is wonderful, and he definitely had these wonderful takeaways that he brought into Heated Rivalry that I could tell just everything from the music that he uses, yeah. It's cut and it's edited, and and the way that it's shot. I didn't look, I didn't take a deep dive to see if he used like the same, you know, cinematographer, like anything like that. But for me, it is kind of like Bridgerton like meets hockey, is like emotional like catharsis. Do you know what I mean? That I didn't know that I needed, that I didn't know that I needed. So there's like all there's all the all the horny stuff, you know, which I appreciate and like fine, but I'm also at a certain age where I am getting a little, I don't know, a little weird with all of the sex. And I'm like, I don't need to see all of the sex. Even with Bridgerton, I was like, I don't need, I get it. Like you're reading the book. I'm like, I get it.

Jason 49:56

Exactly.

Julia 49:57

We know it's good. I I actually want to know more now about the story. Where is this going? Because it was just like, you know, many, it was literal, you know, years of them like hooking up over years. But what I loved about it, this was so close to an experience or a relationship that I could have had in that exact situation. I've had the same text message conversations. I have had the send and wait, and did I say the right thing? Like it's all the same and it just normalizes all of it. And then we're all hoping, you know, that they're gonna like have the go to the cottage moment, you know, and then it happens and you're just like, you know, like I mean, I like I it was just so satisfying.

Jason 50:37

I watched episode, especially episode five. I that was the one where like I watched it like it was a sports game. Like I literally jumped off my couch twice. I was yelling at the screen. So yeah, it was that kind of like a payoff for us. I think a thing too, yes, the target audience for this is mostly women and not a lot of queer women, just a lot of straight women. But for gay people, there is a detailed way of how they presented sex that was the first time that I looked at something and go, Oh, yeah, that's how we actually have sex.

Julia 51:20

Yes.

Jason 51:20

Yeah, those are things that we actually do. Uh well, I'll say I don't know if you ever saw fellow travelers, but if um you haven't, like that one I was also like No, and that was the one you recommended.

Julia 51:31

That was the first show that you had said to me, where you were like, I felt like the the sex in the show was represented in a very true and realistic way. And I I don't have personal experience, but I was a m I I also felt like this is how it is. Like it was very clear to me because that's how it is. Look, I'm not saying that that straight sex in in movies doesn't have more representation because it certainly does, like the normalizing. But even with women, are you kidding me? There is there are it's few and far between the same where women are actually having true, like it's represented how women women actually have sex. I mean, and don't even get me started on porn, none of it's real, like none of it makes any sense. And it's yeah, my my husband and I joke about how we're like, oh, you just throw it in. And it's like, no, you don't just throw the penis in. Like the penis doesn't go just go in. And you know what? Whether it's going into your V or your A, like you still gotta do something first.

Jason 52:26

You don't just know what it is for me is it's the it's the gay male gaze of which they filter this through. Like, I think I haven't even actually done the research, but I assume Jacob Tierney is queer. He is.

Julia 52:40

I mean, well, I shouldn't say that, but he he plays a gay man on letter Kenny. I have always assumed that he was gay.

Jason 52:48

I have always made that assumption as well. And if I'm wrong, I'm sorry, Jacob Tierney. Apologies, but I don't think we are, but like I think his gaze on it, and then also having he's not out, but like it is just Connor is queer. I'm sorry, I'm gonna say it. Um I I I think it's just one of those things where like he feels the need not to come out because it's kind of how I felt. Wait, are we talking?

Julia 53:11

Are we talking about Connor or are we talking about Hudson?

Jason 53:14

We're talking about Connor. Which one's which then?

Julia 53:16

Am I confusing them?

Jason 53:17

Connor is Ilya. Connor is Ilya. Yeah.

Julia 53:23

Okay, I'm totally confused. Okay, because I thought wow, breaking news. I thought uh see, I thought that Hudson Williams, there was controversy because he has a girlfriend, and and I'm just like, who fucking cares? A, it's nobody's business, B doesn't mean he doesn't fuck dudes or whatever, because you can be both. And like again, we're what fucking era are we living in? The the those that know, we know. Like, come on, yeah. I had to say I thought Connor was queer. I'm very confused. Say more.

Jason 53:55

Well, well, I think Connor is queer. I mean, that's my thought, and I but he has never come out and said it.

Julia 54:01

Oh, I see. Okay, yeah.

Jason 54:03

So he's not been like he he didn't feel the need to be like, I am a gay male actor, and which I'm fine with. Like to me, it's pretty obvious. And like because I live in Los Angeles and I'm in the gay community, I've heard stories. So, like, I know things that maybe regular people wouldn't know, but having that perspective in the room, and also Francois Arnard, he's bisexual. So, like having people who are portraying the characters as who they are, there is a a specificity about it that you wouldn't get from just a straight male actor playing that.

Julia 54:39

Agreed. And I would also add that it is we are still living in a time where who you are in the real world could affect the casting of who you are in life. And these are working actors who want to continue to work, and I'm sure that they don't want to just be cast in queer or gay roles or whatever that's gonna look like, and they should have an opportunity to play a straight cis dude if that is something that they want to do, because it is called acting, and some people can't get past that, yeah, which sucks, but also it's called acting, but they're both really good actors, but they're really good, they're really good, so yes, let them do whatever they want to do.

Jason 55:26

That was the other thing I loved about the show is coming from the perspective of someone who is an actor at heart, watching their performances, like and now have watching it like 13 times, like 13 times seeing the subtle things that happen, like my favorite shots in the show are without dialogue when things are happening and they're just processing it. Watching those things is so satisfying.

Julia 55:51

Yeah, I mean, everybody in the show is so good, stellar acting from everybody and so believable. Like, I just bought I bought in, I just completely bought in. I had no doubt that these two people were not completely and utterly in love with each other. And if I were a mom, I would immediately be so upset that I wasn't told sooner and that it was my fault that I didn't create a space that was welcoming for my child. Like it was just so perfectly Yeah.

Jason 56:20

That conversation between Shane and his mom is beautiful and is a different take. The fact that she apologizes to him, it's gonna make me cry.

Julia 56:32

Don't cry, Jason. I just won't I won't ask.

Spooky Story

Jason 56:35

Um the fact that she does it is like a take that we haven't seen. And uh if you're looking at it from both perspectives, both perspectives as I did, it wasn't that Shane didn't feel comfortable telling his mom. It's that he wanted to be something else so badly.

Julia 56:53

Yeah.

Jason 56:53

She it took him all of that time to get to there to realize that he wasn't that person.

Julia 56:58

And that he didn't have to be that. And it's just it's it's it's an idea that that he thought something he thought he had to be that his mom didn't didn't even know that she was projecting. And I think that's where that guilt comes in. So I I definitely I could just relate to that so deeply. And then I could also deeply relate to just completely turning the corner to where we're eating spaghetti and we're drinking wine and we're laughing, and I'm like, okay, I got my phone. This is what we're gonna do. And it's gonna come out like this. And you know what? I am gonna call Nokia or like a Rolex because Rolex is gonna really buy in. Now they're gonna think this is great, and then like my kid just being like, whoa.

Jason 57:32

Hold it, slow down.

Julia 57:34

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So good.

Jason 57:36

And I I want more of that type of and we needed more joy in our life right now, and it just brought so many people joy. So that is great too.

Julia 57:44

Yeah, and I would add to a community that that is already struggling culturally in this country, I think this was exactly like what we needed to lift everybody up and make us all feel a little less shitty about the world. Yeah.

Jason 57:58

Huzzah to Rachel, huzzah to Jacob, huzza to all the boys. 

Julia 58:02

Huzzah to all the boys. Jason, we could talk all night. We have to end this soon. So this is the part of the show where you are gonna tell me some kind of spooky story. So it can be literally, you know, like a literal haunting, a jump scare, a ghost, or it can be kismet. It can be, you know, a really interesting moment of intuition. You know, you got the homework. I know you did the assignment. Let me have it.

Jason 58:28

Yes. So when I was 16, I had just gotten my license. I lived in Fort Lauderdale, and Disney World in Orlando was just a mere three and a half hours away. And I got my license and I talked my parents into letting me take the car with some friends to go to Disney World for the day. And I had never been on like a road trip like that before. So there were four of us, two of my best girlfriends, one of their boyfriends. And before we set out on the road, we stopped at a Dunkin' Donuts and we were getting donuts, and there was this young couple in their 20s who were like standing there and just chatting with us. Like, oh, where are you? What are you guys doing? It's early. You guys are here, what's going on? And they seemed really cool, and we had that conversation. And then the four of us got in the car and we started on our journey. And about halfway there, we were headed north on the Florida Turnpike. About halfway there, I lost control of the car. I flipped my car three times on the interstate and ended up in the southbound lane. My friend broke her femur bone. It was it was trauma, right?

Julia 59:36

Traumatic, yeah.

Jason 59:38

Traumatic. And I just remember like coming to and getting out of the car. And the first two people to help us on the scene were the same two people that were at the Dunkin' Donuts, which, when you think about it, we were both heading north. So somehow they got ahead of us heading north, and then we're going south.

Julia 1:00:01

Like what?

Jason 1:00:01

And then they came upon our accidents. And so my girlfriends and I just started calling them our angels. Like they were our because they couldn't provide like medical help, but they were definitely trying to calm us down in the situation. And the fact that they were there at that moment was just that can't be coincidence. It just can't be like going in an opposite direction.

Julia 1:00:24

It doesn't make any sense at all. At all. That's crazy. A, it's a crazy story. B, this is the first time I've ever heard it, and I've talked to you a lot, and we've known each other a long time, and I had no idea this is something that happened to you. And I'm so glad that you're alive.

Jason 1:00:40

Yeah. Yeah. And there was a lot. I probably didn't talk about it a lot because it was heavily traumatic. And I was the one who was driving. I was the one who lost control of the car. So there was a lot of shame around that. So yeah, I probably it was probably not something that I was just like, hey, let's let's Hey, let's talk about this awful event in my life.

Julia 1:00:56

Yeah.

Bibliomancy

Jason 1:00:57

Yeah. At 19, that was definitely not what I was doing. But yeah, it was it was a big event, and that sticks with me to this day that like there are angels who are walking in the world, and maybe we are one of them. Like maybe at some point we are placed at a place where we can help someone in a way that like seems magical or uh a miraculous to them, living in the space where like we can look at our other human beings and see what we can do to help them.

Julia 1:01:24

Agreed. But don't flip your car. Let's try not to do that. Yeah, try not to do that. Try not to flip that. Look, coming from someone, as you know, who's been in like 10 car accidents, but but you know, subject for another another show or whatever. I now know that it was because of my ADHD, a lot of my issues.

Jason 1:01:43

As soon as you told me that you had been diagnosed with ADHD, one of the first things I thought about was how many car accidents you had gotten in.

Julia 1:01:50

Thank you. Yes, right. And and you know, we again, this is like so separate, but we, you know, it you and I have talked about this, the where when you get that that that formal diagnosis and you look back through your life and you things start to make sense and connect. And, you know, I like much like you're talking about, I've been so ashamed of those experiences and what was wrong with me and why I couldn't just like drive my car, you know. Like um now I know why. And uh and and and as an adult, the way that I drive now and the way that I proceed in like a motor vehicle is very different from um when I was younger, and I have to do it purposefully so that I can be safe. And yeah, I've learned a lot since then. All right, Jason, let's wrap this up. Here's what we're gonna do.

Jason 1:02:31

Okay. 

Julia 1:02:31

This is the bibliomancy part of the show where I have two books, and much like a tarot, I am going to pick a page from this book and it is going to inform whatever uh you question answer to whatever question you have in your brain. We have to pick a book first. So I've got my floriography, which is a book of flowers, and my ornithography, which is a book of birds. So basically the choices are flowers or birds.

Jason 1:03:01

You choose. I'm gonna choose flowers.

Julia 1:03:04

Okay, I'm gonna do flowers.

Jason 1:03:06

Can I make a request? Because as soon as you said you were gonna pick a page, a page number popped in my head.

Julia 1:03:12

Yes, I will choose.

Jason 1:03:15

I will page 72.

Julia 1:03:18

Okay, all right. I'm I'm fully on board with this. As you know, you've known me a long time, you know. That and I we're deeply connected, and I I have a feeling I I probably would have chosen it even like if I just stuck my finger in it. All right, let's see. 72. Okay, I am going to preface this with, and I say this every time, that I am bad at pronouncing things, and whenever I am reading the name of a flower over or a bird, it will be wrong. And everyone just like roll with it. Oh, but I think I'm gonna get this right. A gladiolus. Gladiolus. And the meaning of the gladiolus is you pierce my heart.

Jason 1:03:59

Aww.

Julia 1:04:01

In the Latin, gladius translates to sword, hence the common nickname sword lily for this flower. Both the name and meaning of this large and imposing plant derive from sword-like shape of its the sword-like shape of its leaves. And then it gives a recommendation of like what other flowers you should pair it with, which is a yarrow to heal a broken heart, an anemone, anemone, does that sound familiar? A-N-E-A. Anemone. That sounds right, anemone. And daffodil for unrequited love. And hemlock and marigold for a friend in grief. That is just lovely.

Jason 1:04:39

That is lovely.

Julia 1:04:40

Now tell me your question.

Jason 1:04:42

Oh, I have a question?

Julia 1:04:44

Yes.

Jason 1:04:45

I I didn't I didn't ask a question. I didn't know I had to ask a question. I got really ahead of you.

Julia 1:04:51

You did. Oh my god. Jason, the way that this works is you're supposed to hold a question in your mind, and then this is supposed to inform whatever.

Jason 1:05:02

Okay, let's do it again. Let's do it again. Because I didn't have any question. As soon as you said I'm gonna pick a page, like 72 just kept coming in my head. So that's all I thought about.

Julia 1:05:14

I don't know. I think we're gonna keep this in. Let's like, let's we're not gonna cut that out. Let's roll with this. Yeah, what do we fit? Well, I here we go. Like, tell me what this means to you in this moment. We can do that.

Jason 1:05:25

Well, I kind of intimated about it earlier, but a lot of the things that I was directing my attention to were things to deal with like relationship and love with other people.

Speaker Box 1:05:39

Okay.

Jason 1:05:40

Not even love, but like feelings and crushes.

Speaker Box 1:05:44

Yeah.

Jason 1:05:44

So I think what did it say? A sword through the heart, like that is very much like what I was feeling prior to this brand new life revelation that I had.

Julia 1:05:56

I like this for you.

Jason 1:05:58

Yeah.

Julia 1:05:59

Jason.

Jason 1:05:59

I also have a tattoo of a heart with an arrow through it on my arm. So that's interesting. And I have a bunch of flowers on my chest.

Julia 1:06:08

Jason has a lot of new tattoos, people that I have not seen yet in person. I have only seen a few that, well, I've seen doesn't matter. I've seen them in different states to finish, but I will see you in May and I will see them in their full glory. And I'm very, very excited because adults need stickers. And this is the path that Jason and I are on are collecting stickers for our bodies. This was amazing.

Jason 1:06:28

It was. I love it.

Julia 1:06:30

Thank you so much for being here. So if people want to find you or schedule an appointment with you, how would they do any of these things?

Jason 1:06:37

The best way to find me, there's two. If you want to just follow who I am and see the things I'm doing, that's at the Jason Moyer M-O-Y-E-R on actually any social media, but I only really use Instagram. And then if you want to book with me and you're in Los Angeles, go to Jason Moyer Skincare on Instagram, and there's a button for you to book with me.

Julia 1:07:01

Super. I will put all these things in the show notes, so don't feel like you have to remember all of that, listeners. I will put it in the show notes. All right, Jason. All right. I love you so much. This was great. I'm so glad you did this. All right.

Jason 1:07:12

Thank you for having me.

Julia 1:07:13

Thank you.

Jason 1:07:15

Bye.

Julia 1:07:16

Bye. Agecraft After Dark is written, produced, and edited by me, Julia Grunacki. The music Bernard Bernard Brunett by Ivy Virus. Have a question or a spooky story? I want to hear it. Leave me a message at speakpipe.com forward slash agecraft. And you might just hear yourself on the show. For more agecraft content, join me on Substack at agecraft.substack.com. If you'd like to work with me and learn more about all of the things, head to JuliaGwellness.com. Thanks for listening. Remember, visibility is activism. And until next time, stay curious, stay a little haunted, and I'll see you in the dark.